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Completely independent...

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  #11  
Old 15 January 2012, 05:21 PM
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Re: Completely independent...

hari o
~~~~~~
namasté


sm78 writes,
Quote:
Simply because there is no other than Shiva. Universe is a result of expansion (or contraction, both view is ok) of shiva through his power of self-reflection/self-reference/vimarsha/shakti. (according to KS not SM). The novel idea of KS is that consciousness is not a transcendental sat-chit-ananda (which is compared to Light or Illumination in KS). Because a transcendental bliss is still helpless, as Shankara's nirguna brahman is helpless in front of Maya. Consciousness is ofcourse Illumination/Light but also has the power of self-reflection, to reflect on itself, to travel across itself and thus expanding (contracting) itself into any form, shape, space or time . This is shakti or vimarsha shakti. And universe is a result of this. And Shiva can do this because he is svatantra or possess absolute free will to do whatever he wants to do with himself.
This is a very good offer for one to consider ( when thinking of kaśmir śaivism ). There is an extention to this idea that sm78 offers. In kaśmiri śaivism the '3rd brahma' or tṛtīyam brahman is considered. What can this be ?

It is a standard point of reference that brahman is considered as oṁ-tat-sat in vedānta. In trika ( or kaśmir śaivism ) it is called the 3rd brahma. That is , in oṁ-tat-sat it is the 3rd defining idea or sat that is considered. Yet this brahman is considered vast ( bṛhat) , all pervading (vyāpaka) and is completely in union with śakti.

In vedānta one may call out brahman as oṁ-tat-sat or as sat-cit-ānanda. In kaśmir śaivism this whole concept can be related with one word sauḥ ( sa +au + ḥ) and is considered amṛtbīja, the very heart (hṛdaya) of bhairava ( paramaśiva).

So we find this brahman in kaśmiri śaivism yet more tightly coupled with śakti. It is called the 3rd brahman as there is more alignment with śiva ( or bhairava).

praṇām
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  #12  
Old 23 January 2012, 02:22 PM
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Re: Completely independent...

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté

Quote:
Now think of a being that is completely independent - does not need anything , has no support; is completely and utterly self-reliant. This is called svatantra - self-dependence , independence , self-will. And from this svatantraya (to make subject to one's own will) arises. This is the nature of the Supreme.
This svātantrya is from sva-tantra (as mentioned ), the following of one's own will , freedom of the will , independence . Anytime there is 'flow' there must be energy. Now we can call it svātantrya-śakti, the energy (śakti) of one's free and independent will.


His (śiva's) svātantrya-śakti can be seen in his icchā-śakti; His energy of will. Now what is interesting (to me) is that this icchā-śakti is purportedly non-different from soma-śakti. This soma finds its etymological roots in umā saha. Let's see how this unfolds.



We know śiva is shown with a moon over His head. The moon is also called soma. Here is the beauty of this word: The Supreme by another word is sat ( or sattā - Being, or Truth), brahman. And umā is śrī devī we call pārvatī. When sa(t) comes together with umā what is created ? so+ma ( once again the rules of grammar apply for this addition). What do we call the moon? soma.

When śiva and pārvatī are joined together we get soma (delight). Hence for amāvāsya or the new moon, śiva and pārvatī come together, are enveloped and become moon/soma/delight.

We see the significance of the moon above śiva's head. Hence delight = soma = icchā-śakti = svātantrya-śakti.



praṇām

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Last edited by yajvan : 23 January 2012 at 07:08 PM.
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  #13  
Old 07 July 2012, 04:29 PM
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Re: Completely independent...

Yajvanji,

When sa(t) comes together with umā what is created ? so+ma ( once again the rules of grammar apply for this addition) and because of this we call the moon soma.

I have never heard this before.

I have heard of OM tat Sat.

OM

tat
(that or at that time) http://telugudictionary.org/search.php
http://vedabase.net/t/tat

Sat
becoming/cause/result/truth/eternal/six/perfect
I mean which one is it?

What does OM Tat Sat really mean? And where does it come from?
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  #14  
Old 07 July 2012, 06:31 PM
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Re: Completely independent...

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté

Quote:
Originally Posted by veena View Post
Yajvanji,

When sa(t) comes together with umā what is created ? so+ma ( once again the rules of grammar apply for this addition) and because of this we call the moon soma.

I have never heard this before.

I have heard of OM tat Sat.

OM

tat
(that or at that time) http://telugudictionary.org/search.php
http://vedabase.net/t/tat

Sat
becoming/cause/result/truth/eternal/six/perfect
I mean which one is it?

What does OM Tat Sat really mean? And where does it come from?
Let's see if we can answer your questions satisfactorily and will out too much detail that can ( at times) complicate the matter.

tat = tád. Now what of this tád ? It means 'that'. In our scriptures tád refers to brahman, sometimes called tattva or that-ness, the essence (sāraḥ) of all. Yet there is more ( as you would expect); tád also means ( or is applied to define) thus , in this manner , with regard to that.
So, I can say tad etau ślokau bhavataḥ or 'with reference to that there are these two verses'

sat , there are two things you are thinking.... lets do both.
  • sat = sat ( some may put an accent mark on the a, like this sát ) = being, existence. We know this to be 'that which really is' , or existence , essence , true being or reality in its purest ; in vedānta we know it is brahman.
  • ṣaṭ = ṣaḍ
    Now this ṣaṣ becomes ṣaṭ before hard letters , ṣaḍ before soft letters ;there are addional rules but we need not go further. This ṣaṭ = ṣaḍ = 6, like ṣaḍ ṛtavah or the 6 seasons.
om̐
om̐ is considered praṇava and on occasion oṃkāra. What is praṇava? Praṇava is to praise, and that which rennovates throughly.
It is also praṇa+ va which we can talk of later.

om̐ is also composed of three sounds a , u , m . This is considered a (viṣṇu) , u (śiva) , (brahmā) .

Now what one does not ususally hear is om̐ = āṃ , a word of solemn affirmation and respectful assent , sometimes translated as 'yes , verily , so be it'


You ask, what does om̐ tat sat really mean ? It is 3 dimensions of the same Reality, Brahman.

Yet if we use the words above one could consider om̐ tat sat saying: so be it (om̐) , that reality (tat), that truth (sat)


praṇām
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Last edited by yajvan : 07 July 2012 at 06:54 PM.
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  #15  
Old 07 July 2012, 10:17 PM
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Re: Completely independent...

I just read AUM represents Bhur Bhuva Suvah
Entire creation manifested in three planes, earth, mid region and the heaven.

So then It is okay to think of AUM also as

Shiva

Vishnu

Brhm

We in HInduism associate these Gods or these Gods manifest at the three levels I described above. Shiva -- earth. Vishnu -- higher planets. Brahm -- with Heavens, expansion of the heavens .

Last edited by veena : 07 July 2012 at 10:46 PM.
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  #16  
Old 07 July 2012, 10:56 PM
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Re: Completely independent...

Here is the link where it is written as Brahm:
http://www.jagatgururampalji.org/wor...ran_brahm.html
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  #17  
Old 07 July 2012, 11:23 PM
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Re: Completely independent...

Om Tat Sat (Sanskrit: ओम् तत् सत्, Aum Tat Sat) is a mantra in Sanskrit which literally means All that is the Truth. Essentially meaning the 'Supreme spirit of God (OM) that is (tat) Absolute Truth (Sat).

Om refers to the Supreme Infinite Spirit or Person. Om represents the Shabda (sound of) Brahman.

Tat refers to 'that', or 'that is'

Sat refers to 'the absolute truth', that which is and that which is not, the most fundamental and universal symbol that encompasses all knowledge. Sat is the one and only reality.
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  #18  
Old 08 July 2012, 02:19 PM
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Re: Completely independent...

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté


If you wish to know more of this om̐ (anujñākṣara¹) please consider reading/studying the chāndogya upaniṣad & māṇdūkya upaniṣad.

om̐ iti etad akara ida sarva - this syllable om̐ is all this... māṇdūkya upaniṣad || 1

praṇām

words
anujñākṣara - permission giving syllable
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  #19  
Old 10 July 2012, 01:44 PM
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Re: Completely independent...

Here is something on what you had said:
http://iksvakave.wordpress.com/2012/07/09/verse-on-om/

I actually found the this verse in Gita: Om iti etad askaram idam sarvam .....

If you could summarize in one paragraph what can you say about madukya Upanisad. I know usually it is impossible to summarize these things, I was wondering if you could in few words tell me what it is.

Thank You.
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  #20  
Old 24 January 2013, 02:51 AM
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Re: Completely independent...

Quote:
Originally Posted by yajvan View Post



praṇām
So beautiful! Jai Lord Neelakantha!

It is almost impossible now for one to be fully 'independent' because of the restrictions governments and society as a whole places on us (as well as those we place upon ourselves)...taxes....yeah, taxes...the only assurance other than death.

I briefly considered the idea of moving into the middle of nowhere and building an 'eco-house' but it was still unsustainable as a free-standing unit no matter what I did.

Pretty much like humans too, I guess. Although, in a few months I am moving onto a shareholder farm with lots of opportunity to grow things and make things, but we need the company of other people....despite living on my own in a small country town for 10 years and the only thing I required was public utilities....but honestly...public utilities!!!

Anyway, we can almost be like that, but not quite...not quite.

Aum Namah Shivaya

Last edited by Necromancer : 24 January 2013 at 03:05 AM.
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