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Thread: Hinduism in academia

  1. #1
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    Hinduism in academia

    Hi folks, if you've any thoughts on these sketchy complaints let me know, thanks.

    I’ve done a masters in music and also began PhD in it, then began but again withdrew from a second masters in religion with the intention of changing direction in the PhD. I became disillusioned with the whole academic scene in both areas- music academics don’t listen to music and India academics don’t practice Hinduism or even visit India. Neither have had their souls touched and they remain profoundly innocent.

    The nature of academic activity is intellectual study. My subjects of music and South Asia however have by contrast a core practical dimension- whereas maths perhaps is the study of maths and history the study of history, music and religion essentially aren’t their study. They are visceral aesthetic experiences and indeed interesting exactly for being realms of meaning that move us profoundly, distinct from regular rational account.

    Academics tend to think that they don’t need to worry about the experiences or these things per se, but indeed there is a problem here. To take a analogy in philosophy you could be the world’s leading expert on swimming but if you haven’t learnt to swim you’ll drown in water. And such a person I insist is compromised even on their chosen intellectual level because they’re putting the cart before the horse in not referring their theoretical understanding to hard reality.

    They’re making no observational checks and all they have are sky castle theories floating above the ground, when they should be floating directly or swimming in water, and judging their work by mere internal consistency in a wider and sickly relativistic context. If this argument and its application to art and spirituality needs grounds we can look to the reality checks provided by the universality of aesthetic experience.

    None of the South Asian academics I’ve met either at Edinburgh or Lancaster in Britain had any remote interest in Hinduism per se or travelling in India to actually engage with the culture- asking them if they were Hindu would be like asking if they were in the Flat Earth society, or at best they’d just stare at me and get uncomfortable. Even if they’re not Hindu I’d expect them to have some affinity and enthusiasm for India but again they absolutely do not, none of them. I cannot underline this enough, regardless of how strange it may sound when stated; the system in fact actively selects against the genuine seeker.

    There’s a subliminal awareness in both fields that their position is crazy but they carefully confine their circle of contacts to similar other academics, way up in their towers. I’ve even seen faculty downplaying and undermining students’ efforts at creating a Vedic society or hosting festival events, or making any relation between the study and Hinduism itself- there’s a lot of fear.

    They could be studying zoology for all the engagement they have with the subject itself and instead study it for other reasons. I've been to six music conferences including three in the US and one Indian philosophy conference and met great numbers of these characters, whose reaction to me is consistently some combination of mystification and horror. I’m done with it and can see there’s something seriously wrong with the whole educational basis of Western thought. It’s interesting though and I’ve put together extensive notes trying to make sense of it all.
    Last edited by Girisha; 02 November 2013 at 08:09 PM.
    Be without the three gunas, O Arjuna

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    Re: Hinduism in academia

    Well for what it's worth, I'm an academic in astrophysics and I practice Hinduism.

    From what you're saying it sounds like you're expressing a discontent that a lot of Western Hindus rightly have with Indians, namely that a lot of us don't appreciate our own religion very much. And I don't think you'll get much argument from Indian Hindus here, granted there's a large selection bias given that you're inquiring of people on a forum about Hinduism.

    There are surprisingly few Indians in my field. I used to have a collaborator who was here (in the US) for a postdoc. He called himself an atheist, but he did have some affinity for Hinduism and Hindu culture. Just the other day I was reading the PhD thesis of one of my advisor's former students, and in his acknowledgements he mentions the Divine. Given the small number of data points here, I guess you can't draw any conclusions based on what I've said.

    Think about this. Are the Indian people you met disinterested in Hinduism because they're academics, or because they perhaps may have grown up in the West? I was born here in the US, and I can say that it's really hard to be a Hindu here. It's not anyone' fault, it's just that when you're growing up in India the culture is replete with Hindu influence. But over here it's a predominantly Christian culture, and you need to actively assert your faith and culture or it will fall by the wayside. A lot of Indians are more concerned with economic success and neglect this. My own parents were only moderately religious, and have never really pushed me to be especially spiritual.

    I think you may have elucidated a major problem with Hindus in the West, namely that we don't take a particularly active role in practicing our own religion. That's why every Indian here in America is a doctor or engineer. We have no representation in the sciences or arts, and most importantly, none in politics and matters of state. This is definitely a serious problem for us, I think.

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    Re: Hinduism in academia

    Vannakkam:

    Wow, Sanjaya, I read something completely different than you did. Hopefully Girisha will return and clarify us.

    I thought he was talking about western academia and Hinduism, how they (western born scholars) are really out of touch with the reality on the ground. Just like in my profession, the educational theorists don't figure they should ever have to go into an actual classroom again.

    But maybe I was wrong.

    Aum namasivaya

  4. #4

    Re: Hinduism in academia

    Pranam-s,

    A person can know a million things about archery. The bow types, the string types, the nock points, the arrow types, the names of successful archers, etc. etc. etc.

    But, give that person a bow and ask him/her to shoot at the target, and watch him/her not be able to follow through.

    A person can know everything about cricket. The players, the shots, the statistics, etc. etc. etc.

    But, give that person a bat or a season-ball, and watch him/her not be able to bat nor bowl.

    - - - - -

    That's how I read Girisha's comment. Hopefully, he can return and share further insight, especially the notes he has written as mentioned in the last part of his OP.

    regards

  5. #5

    Re: Hinduism in academia

    Namaste,

    I also understood Girisha's post to be addressing the concept that has
    dominated much of Western intellectual and academic culture for at least
    the last century- namely, that the only valid approach toward
    understanding a given subject is the creation of maximum dispassion,
    abstraction, and "objectivity" prior to any investigation or discussion.

    This is always seen as important in avoiding any possible accusation of
    bias, or of someone bending the facts to fit a preconception. What is
    ignored is the investigators' bias in favor of the standards and values that
    academia has evolved over the course of its history, and how those
    standards and values, which may have great utility in "hard" sciences such
    as chemistry or physics, have limited value in subjects which are not
    materialist by their very nature.

    The root of this can be seen in both the historical Western virtual
    enshrinement of the ancient Greek philosophers and logicians, combined
    with the more modern achievements of the material sciences, which
    were based in adopting a reductionist and empirical practice.

    The technological strides made possible through embracing these
    principles had the effect of convincing the Western mind that this mode
    of thought would prove best in all areas, thereby spreading to such
    arenas in which the disallowance of a cultural, moral or experiential
    perspective proves disastrous; only recently has the folly of this begun
    to make itself known to the fiercely defended towers of academia, and
    the disconnect between that extremely insular world, and the greater
    world which it purports to both serve and know best how to serve, will
    unfortunately remain as long as those values, and the enormous amounts
    of money and pride connected to them, remain entrenched in those
    areas of study least suited to them.

    Hopefully these thoughts of mine will make some sense; my apologies
    if they seem unclear.

    JAI MATA DI
    || जय माता की ||

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    Re: Hinduism in academia

    Hello folks, many thanks for those replies.

    Totally snowed under with work today but hope to write some replies tomorrow, for the moderator first of course, a policy I can understand.

    I'll also have a few general questions on Hinduism. A little more about me, I've a 25 year interest in Indian philosophy and been a practicing Hindu for about six years, entered India a tenth time earlier this year, I'm a keen writer on the culture, and have given several talks. I have a great love and affinity for India, and thus the ranting about the academic situation...

    Perhaps I can ask one off-topic question while I've got a minute here- sometimes in temples I'm asked if I have a gotra, which I understand as an affiliation with a clan or lineage back to an ancient sage. I chose Agastya, whose name is a similar meaning to Girisha, mountain lord. Any thoughts on this?

    Agastya...


    Will get back to you again with some clarification of my thoughts on the dastardly Anglo-American South Asian faculties.
    Last edited by Girisha; 04 November 2013 at 05:32 PM.
    Be without the three gunas, O Arjuna

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    Re: Hinduism in academia

    Vannakkam: As far as I know, you can't just choose a gotra on your own. Here the priest just skip gotra if the person doesn't know it.

    Aum Namasivaya

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    Re: Hinduism in academia

    Namaste,
    Quote Originally Posted by sanjaya View Post
    We have no representation in the sciences or arts, and most importantly, none in politics and matters of state. This is definitely a serious problem for us, I think.
    Totally off topic but,

    2 out of 50 state Governors are of Indian descent,
    Several state legislators and city council members in various areas are of Indian descent,
    Miss NY and Miss NJ are of Indian descent,
    One of the guys on staff to John Stewart, Aasif Mandavi, is of Indian descent, and Kal Penn, the guy who left Hugh Laurie's series to work in the Obama Administration, and the girl (Archie Punjabi) on 'Good Wife', and the girl from Bend It Like.. (Parminder Nagra) who was in a medical drama series for some years,
    One of the Big Bang Theory characters is an Indian,
    I personally don't know of any, but if you looked at the senior scientific staff of DuPont, Dow Chemicals and many pharmaceutical companies, you might be astonished to find quite a few of them to be 'bros',
    The guy who got booted out of the White House recently for having illegally tweeted the administration inside info for two years is of Indian descent,
    And the CEO of Pepsi, Indra Nooyi, and the ex-CEO of CitiBank, Vikram Pandit, and half the Wall Street inside traders behind bars...

    That covers the fields of Arts, Sciences, Politics, Economics and crooks. Don't sell us short.

    Back in the 60's when US opened up towards immigration from India, they were selective in importing only the professionals, mostly Docs and Ings. Since then things have changed a lot. Gujus own half the motels in US and many opt to put a copy of the ISKCON version of the Bhagwad Gita in every room. Every crack in the glass ceiling is taken advantage of. Perhaps you are not as disappointed with your own ethnic group after reading these comments?

    Pranam.
    Last edited by Believer; 04 November 2013 at 02:14 PM.

  9. #9

    Re: Hinduism in academia

    Namaste!

    I am similarly snowed under with work, so will post at greater length on your main question (an important and interesting one to me) in another day or two.

    But regarding gotra, my understanding, like Eastern Mind's, is that one cannot simply choose one. Because Kaśyapa is regarded as the father of all of humanity, if one does not know one's gotra, then one is automatically of the Kaśyapa gotra. This is a practice I have witnessed in several temples and have had explained to me by priests in both India and the US.
    "One who makes a habit of prayer and meditation will easily overcome all difficulties and remain calm and unruffled in the midst of the trials of life." (Holy Mother Sarada Devi)

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    Re: Hinduism in academia

    Quote Originally Posted by sanjaya View Post
    I think you may have elucidated a major problem with Hindus in the West, namely that we don't take a particularly active role in practicing our own religion. That's why every Indian here in America is a doctor or engineer. We have no representation in the sciences or arts, and most importantly, none in politics and matters of state. This is definitely a serious problem for us, I think.
    Academia are only slaves to whoever supports them financially. In the west, financial support for universities has always come from Christians and Jews. But now major academic institutions are taking bribes from the Saudi Arab oil magnets and have to protect Islamic interests. An outspoken Hindu economics professor can be kicked out of Harvard if he speaks against terrorism in an Indian newspaper. You cannot change academia by becoming one of their PhD puppets. You have to be the puppet master and this can only be accomplished by financial means.
    Last edited by Sahasranama; 05 November 2013 at 02:56 AM.

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