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Thread: Namaskar

  1. #1

    Namaskar

    Hare Krishna!

    Dear Friends,

    Namaskar to all of you from me, Dilip.

    The whole god-sent idea to join this Forum was to share the views to make progress towards knowing the significance of this human birth and life.

    Look forward to hearing from all of you. Let there be light of 'Chaitanya' in everybody's life.

    Lots of love and best wishes,

    Dilip.

  2. Re: Namaskar

    Namaste, Dilip.

    I am completely new here too, so I thought I would say hello.

    Is it Krishna you are particularly devoted to?
    I knew almost nothing about Krishna until recently, when I read the Gita. I found it inspiring in the most profound ways and yet a bit disconcerting in places.

    I love much of the art dedicated to Krishna.

    Anyway....lovely to meet you.

    Peace and Light.

    John

  3. #3

    Re: Namaskar

    Hare Krishna !

    Originally from dear John .....
    Namaste, Dilip.

    I am completely new here too, so I thought I would say hello.

    Is it Krishna you are particularly devoted to?
    I knew almost nothing about Krishna until recently, when I read the Gita. I found it inspiring in the most profound ways and yet a bit disconcerting in places.

    I love much of the art dedicated to Krishna.

    Anyway....lovely to meet you.

    Peace and Light.

    John

    .................................................................................................... ....

    Dear John,

    Namaste. It is so very nice to meet you too !

    Yes, John, I am devoted to God, whose name for me happens to be "Krishna". I am sure, you too are devoted to God but may be you know a different name for Him. For all practical purposes , mundane or transcendental, it does not really matter. My friends call me Dilip, mom calls me Khoka, sons call me Baba and wife calls me Ogo, nephews and nieces call me Kaku and the grandchildren call me Dadu and unknown guys address Dada.....but in all the cases all are calling me only. It is just that.

    I do not know or do not want to know what religion you belong to. We get very close to our dear Lord when we can identify ourselves with all other religions or rather when others can identify us with all religions. It is not very subtle to understand, it is very simple. A truly good Christian is undoubtedly a good Hindu or Muslim or Buddhist or Sikh,...anything. He then goes above all religions and sees his beloved Lord everywhere,all pervading... in every being, in every animate and inanimate objects. God's love radiates through him and he becomes a true follower or a devotee.

    Love, love and love.....there is no other easier way to get to Him. Give Him any name but love Him the way the young true lovers feel for each other.

    I am sorry, it has been quite lengthy. I am not sure if I have disturbed your happiness or composure. However, thank you very much for your patient reading. Would love to hear more from you again. Take care and keep well.

    Lots of love and best wishes,

    Dilip.

  4. Re: Namaskar

    Beautiful, Dilip!
    A blessing of light to me, you are!

    In fact - I began with Christianity and had a long and very worthwhile journey with that. I would like to say that I completely acknowledge Krishna as God. What you say about the names we all have for God is indeed very relevant.

    Hope to encounter you many times on the forums, beloved of Krishna.
    Namaste!

  5. #5

    Re: Namaskar

    Hare Krishna !

    Originally from John Mortimer....

    "
    Beautiful, Dilip!
    A blessing of light to me, you are!

    In fact - I began with Christianity and had a long and very worthwhile journey with that. I would like to say that I completely acknowledge Krishna as God. What you say about the names we all have for God is indeed very relevant.

    Hope to encounter you many times on the forums, beloved of Krishna.
    Namaste!

    Dear John,

    It is very nice to hear from you again , thank you.
    My profession does not allow me the privilege of using Internet at will, that is why I am late to reply. I am sorry.

    I remember in your first post to me you had said, " I like very much the art works dedicated to Krishna." This gives me the opportunity to expand on where I had stopped last time.

    When we talk about love, naturally it is very difficult to love some unknown formless being. We need a physical presence or symbol. Since we are bound by qualities, it so happens that ordinary folks like most of us would like to choose and love a beautiful photograph or deity or idol. To gather your mind and concentration, it is important that the focus of concentration is as beautiful as possible. It must be said that all idols, deities, pictures,etc. are only for the beginners those who cannot easily concentrate for meditation. Those work as a medium for them to concentrate on their beloved . Seemingly, that is why we see so many matchless and beautiful photographs and idols of Krishna.

    All ways, methods and means are for one single purpose only and that is successful meditation, where you get absorbed so much that you lose all your senses, even that of the most difficult thing, that is your body. Then only, one goes into trance and into the transcendental realm of bliss. True knowledge comes.

    Dear John, on this earth our biggest enemy lies within ourselves only. That is the sense of the 'I' and 'my', 'me' and 'mine'. Our constant efforts should be to change it to 'thee' and 'thine'. Even for our body we have to do this, 'thy' and 'thine'. When we say, everything belongs to Him then how anything including the body can be ours! That is why renouncing is a very misguiding term, often wrongly used. How can we renounce anything when nothing truly belongs to us. It is our ego and maya(Illusion) by which we form the ideas of the senses, 'I' and 'my'. Only these senses are ours and we can renounce only that. Long regular practice of meditation (By any means) slowly dissolves this ego and makes us deserving and prepared to meet our beloved God.

    Oh, I am sorry again, this has been a very lengthy one. Influence of some sort of a meditation that I kept on writing. More next time. Would love to hear from you and all others here.

    Love and best wishes,

    Dilip.




  6. Re: Namaskar

    Quote Originally Posted by Dilip View Post

    Dear John,

    It is very nice to hear from you again , thank you.
    My profession does not allow me the privilege of using Internet at will, that is why I am late to reply. I am sorry.
    No problem at all, Dilip....I can only give very limited time to the internet also.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dilip View Post
    I remember in your first post to me you had said, " I like very much the art works dedicated to Krishna." This gives me the opportunity to expand on where I had stopped last time.

    When we talk about love, naturally it is very difficult to love some unknown formless being. We need a physical presence or symbol. Since we are bound by qualities, it so happens that ordinary folks like most of us would like to choose and love a beautiful photograph or deity or idol. To gather your mind and concentration, it is important that the focus of concentration is as beautiful as possible. It must be said that all idols, deities, pictures,etc. are only for the beginners those who cannot easily concentrate for meditation. Those work as a medium for them to concentrate on their beloved . Seemingly, that is why we see so many matchless and beautiful photographs and idols of Krishna.

    All ways, methods and means are for one single purpose only and that is successful meditation, where you get absorbed so much that you lose all your senses, even that of the most difficult thing, that is your body. Then only, one goes into trance and into the transcendental realm of bliss. True knowledge comes.
    I understand. It is interesting what you say about the body, (and thereby implicitly about the mind, which is inseparable from the body). I used to view the body very negatively. This was incredibly destructive. What I have found recently is that when I think of "my" body as "this body" and then sense the aliveness of it's inner energy field a great love and wonder comes about. This only happens if "my" is replaced by "this". Which of course leads on to your next part......
    Quote Originally Posted by Dilip View Post
    Dear John, on this earth our biggest enemy lies within ourselves only. That is the sense of the 'I' and 'my', 'me' and 'mine'. Our constant efforts should be to change it to 'thee' and 'thine'. Even for our body we have to do this, 'thy' and 'thine'. When we say, everything belongs to Him then how anything including the body can be ours! That is why renouncing is a very misguiding term, often wrongly used. How can we renounce anything when nothing truly belongs to us. It is our ego and maya(Illusion) by which we form the ideas of the senses, 'I' and 'my'. Only these senses are ours and we can renounce only that. Long regular practice of meditation (By any means) slowly dissolves this ego and makes us deserving and prepared to meet our beloved God.
    Are the senses ours, though? Or is it the interpretation of the sensory data that appears to belong to..........a person, I suppose. It seems sometimes that the person is nothing more than an inference. The way I have understood this up to now, the sensory data and the mind interpreting just arise spontaneously. It is this strange tendency to identify with the mind that causes all the trouble.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dilip View Post
    Oh, I am sorry again, this has been a very lengthy one. Influence of some sort of a meditation that I kept on writing. More next time. Would love to hear from you and all others here.
    Oh, please feel free to be as long as you like! I'm loving it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dilip View Post
    Love and best wishes,

    Dilip.
    The very warmest loving wishes to you, Dilip.

  7. #7

    Re: Namaskar

    Hare Krishna!
    Dear John,
    Thank you for your very beautiful post.
    My dear Sri Krishna, like always, has brought me to the right place and I am glad to have you and others here as my dear friends. Your simplicity and humility has touched and inspired me.
    Regarding ‘body’ your observation is beautiful and it proves our point. This also indicates that you are progressing well and in the right direction.
    Regarding the senses you have put it very nicely and truly that it is the mind which causes all the trouble in its interpretation of the sensory data that comes to the mind. How the mind will accept them and react is the point. If we deeply think over the commonly known and talked about senses, i.e. anger, greed, desire, malice, jealousy, infatuation, etc., we would not miss to understand and note that the base or core of these senses are the sense of the ‘I’ and ‘My’.
    Dear John, these senses are somewhat like congenital diseases which come with us when we take birth. These, with their associated qualities, keep us away from God and true knowledge. Knowingly or unknowingly we are struggling continuously to subdue and overcome these senses. That is why the penance, meditation, company of the saints, adherence to the truth , etc. is so very important. It is all to train your mind to go above the senses. Everything is in the process of evolution and nothing great happens overnight. It is a long drawn and very difficult process. That is why Sri Krishna told Arjun that it is difficult but by habit formation and unrelenting efforts it can be achieved. (Abhyas-i kevalam). This habit formation becomes possible and easy when there is love for the purpose, love for your beloved Lord.
    It is very difficult to get rid of the senses but it is very easy to turn their heads and very well keep them for your spiritual gain. When I and My become only for, “ My Lord and I am His servant”, anger for only because of still not getting Him, greed only for craving for Him, jealousy only for so many have seen Him and I am still wanting, desire… intense desire only for merger with Him, infatuation so much so to drive to near derangement to see Him ! If we can do this, then even with the senses we can live in peace and can very much make this life significant.
    But for spiritual realization love and respect is of utmost importance. Because then only you can truly and unconditionally surrender. And after surrender everything automatically happens, one after the other, and true knowledge comes. Interestingly, please note that Arjuna received the knowledge of the Gita only when he had surrendered to Lord Sri Krishna(Chapter-2, Shloka-7).
    The best teaching and practice is, “Naaham, naaham…Tuhun, Tuhun” (Not me, not me…You,You). This automatically brings rest of the things to you… love, respect and surrender.
    We will keep more for the next time. Please do write to me – would love to hear from you and others. Take care and keep well.
    With lots of love,
    Dilip.
    Last edited by Dilip; 01 August 2014 at 07:51 AM.

  8. #8

    Re: Namaskar

    Quote Originally Posted by Dilip View Post
    My dear Sri Krishna, like always, has brought me to the right place and I am glad to have you and others here as my dear friends. Your simplicity and humility has touched and inspired me.
    Namaste
    Quote Originally Posted by Dilip View Post
    Regarding ‘body’ your observation is beautiful and it proves our point. This also indicates that you are progressing well and in the right direction. Regarding the senses you have put it very nicely and truly that it is the mind which causes all the trouble in its interpretation of the sensory data that comes to the mind. How the mind will accept them and react is the point. If we deeply think over the commonly known and talked about senses, i.e. anger, greed, desire, malice, jealousy, infatuation, etc., we would not miss to understand and note that the base or core of these senses are the sense of the ‘I’ and ‘My’.
    Ah - I see - we were using the concept of "senses" in different ways. I am clear on what you mean now. It is indeed a very profound and sobering truth that the core of all negative emotions is indeed the sense of "I". Here is an interesting question though.... Does the non-verbal sense of "I am" ever give rise to negative emotions? I'm honestly not sure. By "non-verbal sense" I mean being aware of existing but not as an individual. Whilst this experience has arisen in me, it is not frequent or long-lasting. I don't have the same degree of experience in meditation as you do - I don't know how much difference that makes? I find mantra very conducive to forgetting self-as-individual.
    Self-as-individual can of course give rise to many positive emotions also. Eckhart Tolle proposes a single primordial emotion that manifests as all the various positive and negative emotions in duality. What do you think of that?
    Quote Originally Posted by Dilip View Post
    Dear John, these senses are somewhat like congenital diseases which come with us when we take birth. These, with their associated qualities, keep us away from God and true knowledge. Knowingly or unknowingly we are struggling continuously to subdue and overcome these senses. That is why the penance, meditation, company of the saints, adherence to the truth , etc. is so very important. It is all to train your mind to go above the senses.
    I think it was Nisargadatta Maharaj who observed that in mantra, Tamas is present in the static repetition but Satva is present in the words and so even Tamas serves the cause of transcendence.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dilip View Post
    Everything is in the process of evolution and nothing great happens overnight. It is a long drawn and very difficult process. That is why Sri Krishna told Arjun that it is difficult but by habit formation and unrelenting efforts it can be achieved. (Abhyas-i kevalam).
    The unrelenting effort means Rajas, maybe??
    Quote Originally Posted by Dilip View Post
    This habit formation becomes possible and easy when there is love for the purpose, love for your beloved Lord.
    Oh yes, I totally get that.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dilip View Post
    It is very difficult to get rid of the senses but it is very easy to turn their heads and very well keep them for your spiritual gain. When I and My become only for, “ My Lord and I am His servant”, anger for only because of still not getting Him, greed only for craving for Him, jealousy only for so many have seen Him and I am still wanting, desire… intense desire only for merger with Him, infatuation so much so to drive to near derangement to see Him ! If we can do this, then even with the senses we can live in peace and can very much make this life significant.
    It is certainly a very internally active approach!
    Quote Originally Posted by Dilip View Post
    But for spiritual realization love and respect is of utmost importance. Because then only you can truly and unconditionally surrender. And after surrender everything automatically happens, one after the other, and true knowledge comes. Interestingly, please note that Arjuna received the knowledge of the Gita only when he had surrendered to Lord Sri Krishna(Chapter-2, Shloka-7).
    ...and if may quote from the translation I have, what Krishna says to Arjuna after that surrender..........
    "You utter wise words, yet you have been mourning those who should not be mourned; the truly wise do not grieve for the living or the dead. There never was a time when I was not, or you, or these rulers of men. Nor will there ever be a time when we shall cease to be, all of us hereafter."
    Isn't it beautiful?! The surrender is into timeless Oneness.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dilip View Post
    The best teaching and practice is, “Naaham, naaham…Tuhun, Tuhun” (Not me, not me…You,You). This automatically brings rest of the things to you… love, respect and surrender.
    Reminds me a bit of "Neti, Neti", ("not this, not this").
    Quote Originally Posted by Dilip View Post
    We will keep more for the next time. Please do write to me – would love to hear from you and others. Take care and keep well.
    You too, Dilip.....and yes, it would be great to hear from others also.

  9. #9

    Re: Namaskar

    Hare Krishna !

    Dear John,

    I am so very happy to hear from you . Yours is a beautiful post and it inspires.


    Quote from your text :

    "Ah - I see - we were using the concept of "senses" in different ways. I am clear on what you mean now. It is indeed a very profound and sobering truth that the core of all negative emotions is indeed the sense of "I". Here is an interesting question though.... Does the non-verbal sense of "I am" ever give rise to negative emotions? I'm honestly not sure. By "non-verbal
    sense" I mean being aware of existing but not as an individual. Whilst this experience has arisen in me, it is not frequent or long-lasting. I don't have the same degree of experience in meditation as you do - I don't know how much difference that makes? I find mantra very conducive to forgetting self-as-individual. Self-as-individual can of course give rise to many positive emotions also. Eckhart Tolle proposes a single primordial emotion that manifests as all the various positive and negative emotions in duality. What do you think of that?"

    It's wonderful ! It is a grace upon me that I have you as my friend on the journey.Non-verbal or verbal sense of "I am" is good when it is not "My I". Non-verbal sense is good when one is aware of existence as a divine consciousness and not as a body or individual sense. At least the mind should think that I am not body or anything else but a form of Him, I am nothing but a divine consciousness. I am eternal not as a body but as divine consciousness. Body will perish not me. He is me and I am Him or He is in me as Divine Consciousness and I am that Divine Consciousness. As long as we separate ourselves from Him, He remains separated. The whole purpose of successful meditation is to realize this only. The purpose is to dissolve everything into nothingness, dissolve mind, body and even the
    support, that is, your mantra. Even the 'mantra' will be lost as you will be lost into the Ocean of spiritual consciousness,

    Ocean of bliss, bliss and bliss......ananda, ananda and ananda. Only consciousness will remain.

    Verbal sense or non-verbal sense gives emotions, positive or negative. Please do not go into that and totally ignore them. A time comes when everything stops, even the breath ! Then you go into that, that only you get to know but cannot describe.

    Honestly, it has been very long since stopped reading books or knowing much about what is happening around. I really do not understand what Eckhart Tolle actually meant by saying that. Any complicated issue makes me uncomfortable. Do not believe that emotions can be proposed, so single primordial emotion that manifests as all the various positive and negative emotions in duality... is something very confusing. With due respect to him, it must be said that we do not need to concentrate on such an issue.


    Quote from your text :

    "I think it was Nisargadatta Maharaj who observed that in mantra, Tamas is present in the static repetition but Satva is present in the words and so even Tamas serves the cause of transcendence."

    My obeisance to Nisargadatta Maharaj and most humbly I say that it must be so. Let there be Raja, Tama and Satva gunas (qualities) but let the mind not be in them. Your mind only causes the transcedence by going above all the gunas. By the Gunas all this nature is enveloped. Nature is Maya and distraction. So, one has to necessarily go above all the gunas ( Nature and Maya) to go into the transcendental world. Then only, despite having all gunas, one can become nirguna.

    Quote from your post :

    "The unrelenting effort means Rajas, maybe?"

    Dear John, no work and nothing is outside the gunas, as all gunas come from Him only. Unrelenting effort does not mean non-stop efforts, it is regular and sincere efforts discharged in a disciplined manner. Some tries very hard for hours/days and then out of frustration gives up totally. That must not be the case. It must be done regularly, preferably at the same time daily, for a specific period of time without getting tired.

    Quote :

    "It is certainly a very internally active approach!"

    Yes, it is very much so. If one tries, it becomes easy very soon. This can easily occur if there is 'aheituki bhakti' (Devotion and surrender without any practical reason) and if we can cry just once for him without any practical cause. Just love and and 'prem' (highest form of love) can do this. We have not seen Him, we do not know Him, yet we love Him so much that we cannot do without Him. He, who can shed this tears of aheituki prem and bhakti even for once, permanently becomes His. He or she becomes His true devotee and does never perish. Glory to the Lord and glory to such Bhaktas.

    Quote :

    "...and if may quote from the translation I have, what Krishna says to Arjuna after that surrender.........."You utter wise words, yet you have been mourning those who should not be mourned; the truly wise do not grieve for the living or the dead. There never was a time when I was not, or you, or these rulers of men. Nor will there ever be a time when we shall cease to be, all of us hereafter."
    Isn't it beautiful?! The surrender is into timeless Oneness."


    Dear John, you are the blessed one. How nicely and easily you have got it right ! Understanding the Gita's shlokas in its right perspective is a matter of great blessing. One should read it over and over again to get to its right meaning and comprehensiveness. A simple mind gets it faster. In this life struggle (Sansar) each one of us is like Arjun standing in the middle of Kurukhsetra (Sansar battle ground) facing all sorts of enemies & problems and we are perplexed, like Arjuna only, how to go about it and how to tackle them. The Gita is probably easier and best understood when the reader himself becomes Arjuna and considers that Krishna (the Lord) is giving him the advices.

    Quote :

    "Reminds me a bit of "Neti, Neti", ("not this, not this")."

    It's a real pleasure sharing views with you.


    More next time. Please do write. Take care.

    Lots of love,

    Dilip.

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