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Thread: What is Vaishnava ?

  1. #1

    What is Vaishnava ?

    Namaste,

    This is a very general and basic question. I would like to know what is Vaishnava.

    I would sincerely appreciate any thoughts, opinions and comments.


    Hari Om,

    Dhanya

  2. #2

    Re: What is Vaishnava ?

    Namaste

    VaishNav = Of VishNu.
    1. Belonging to, in complete shelter of, dependant on and surrendered to BhagavAn VishNu, NArAyaN. That is a VaishNav (person)
    2. Anything related to or about VishNu is VaishNav (e.g. scripture, teaching, tradition etc.)

    As a quick preliminary answer you may want to read this post -- and of course listen to the bhajan in it.
    http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/sho...90&postcount=4

    The comprehensive answer would be a good number of quotes -- shloka straight from the shAstra --- Bhagavad GeetA, Shrimad BhAgvat mahApurAn and other VaishNav literature such as Chaitanya CharitrAmrut which lists 26 qualities of a pure devotee of BhagavAn.

    ---

    At this point I would simply put a personal note --- a VaishNav may at some point fall asleep into complete peace and thoughtless state at the Lotus Feet of BhagavAn VishNu or His Devotee , or their Guru. However -- the very foundation of that peace for the VaishNav is that they are at the Lotus Feet of or in the sAnidhya (association), sharaN (shelter) of Shri NArAyaN having surrendered anything that they would call their own (i.e. ego).
    Also, they have the choice to wake up out of that state into serene content bliss to simply jump up and get into a "roaring kirtan" mode if you know what I mean.

    In short, the VaishNav is like a fish out of water when at any metaphorical distance from BhagavAn. When awake, they will do everything only for the pleasure of BhagavAn.

    tan man dhan sab hai terA.
    terA tuzko arpaN,
    kyA lAge merA?

    If everything is Yours, my Lord, including my existence, my identity, then what would there be to hanker about other than Your presence?

    kAnhA ne mAkhan bhAve re, kAnhA ne mishri bhAve re
    Know what the Lord likes. Give Him 56 exotic dishes and delicacies -- He will not even look at them. Just give Him a nice big ball of mAkhan (freshly churned butter) and He will dance for you
    Last edited by smaranam; 25 November 2014 at 08:04 PM. Reason: added some direct basics
    || Shri KRshNArpaNamastu ||

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    Re: What is Vaishnava ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dhanya View Post
    Namaste,

    This is a very general and basic question. I would like to know what is Vaishnava.

    I would sincerely appreciate any thoughts, opinions and comments.


    Hari Om,

    Dhanya
    Well, according to me, Vaishnawa means who's a devotee of Vishnu or his incarnations like Krishna, who doesn't see any duality anywhere, has a firm conviction in my mind that all is Brahman ie vasudeva sarvam..

    Vaishnawa is one who's surrendered himself completely with his ego (Individuality) and so he's one with Vishnu. Vishnu is devotee, devotee is Vishnu ..

    After realization he realises himself in himself, one with Brahman, attains the peak of devotion where there's no duality of devotee and bhagavan.. Only completeness of Brahman without duality remains, the absolute joy beyond any attribute..
    Hari On!

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    Re: What is Vaishnava ?

    Namaste,

    In a post I started recently,we are discussing about the Smarta tradition.A Smarta individual's favorite deity maybe Sri Vishnu but he/she also worships other Vedic deities.Therefore, a Smarta Vaishnava is also a Vaishnava but unlike other Vishnu devotees of sectarian traditions, believes that other deities are equal to Sri Vishnu and honors them in his/her worship.
    He dances in the golden hall of Chidambaram, Let us worship His rosy anklet girt Feet.

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    Re: What is Vaishnava ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ram116040 View Post
    Namaste,

    In a post I started recently,we are discussing about the Smarta tradition.A Smarta individual's favorite deity maybe Sri Vishnu but he also worships other Vedic deities.Therefore, a Smarta Vaishnava is also Vaishnava but unlike other sectarian traditions, believes that other deities are equal to Sri Vishnu and honors them in his/her worship.
    Hello ..


    Smartism is the oldest form of vaishnawism. Not my personal view but Vishnu Purana, which is a vaishnawa purana, mentions Smarta sect.

    Now you may question who are smarta actually, they're Advaitians. Smarta mean those who are well versed in smriti and Shruti and accept all purana and so are non-sectarian..

    Thank You
    Hari On!

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    Re: What is Vaishnava ?

    Quote Originally Posted by hinduism♥krishna View Post
    Hello ..


    Smartism is the oldest form of vaishnawism. Not my personal view but Vishnu Purana, which is a vaishnawa purana, mentions Smarta sect.

    Now you may question who are smarta actually, they're Advaitians.

    Thank You
    Namaste Ji,

    I haven't
    understood what Advaita is and probably its gonna be some time before I get to the basics.

    I think it is better to say they are abhedins i.e. the Smarta doesn't see bheda or difference between different Devatas.As we say the realtionship between Sri Shiva and Devi Uma is abedha type.So Advaita= Abheda?

    He dances in the golden hall of Chidambaram, Let us worship His rosy anklet girt Feet.

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    Re: What is Vaishnava ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ram116040 View Post
    Namaste Ji,

    I haven't
    understood what Advaita is and probably its gonna be some time before I get to the basics.

    I think it is better to say they are abhedins i.e. the Smarta doesn't see bheda or difference between different Devatas.As we say the realtionship between Sri Shiva and Devi Uma is abedha type.So Advaita= Abheda?
    Smarta just means that who are adherents of both shruti and smruti. They accept all purana like shiva, Vishnu or devi ganesha purana. Smartism came after shrautism. Before the creation of purana, there was only shrauta dharma. Vyasa and his various disciples propagated smartism for the welfare of kaliyugic people. And when this dharma was in danger by Buddhism, bhagavan Vishnu himself incarnated as adi shankar to establish vedic path-smartism.

    Thank You
    Hari On!

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    Re: What is Vaishnava ?

    Quote Originally Posted by hinduism♥krishna View Post
    Hello ..


    Smartism is the oldest form of vaishnawism. Not my personal view but Vishnu Purana, which is a vaishnawa purana, mentions Smarta sect.

    Thank You
    Namaste Ji,

    Worship of Sri Vishnu according to the Vedic Yajnas might be the oldest un-named,non-sectarian Vaishnavam.Also,Sri Vaikanasa Agamam is probably much older than Sri Vishnu Maha Purana.
    He dances in the golden hall of Chidambaram, Let us worship His rosy anklet girt Feet.

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    Re: What is Vaishnava ?

    To me, a Vaishnava means 'unconditional love'. Somewhere I read that a true Vaishnava is one that is humbler than a blade of grass. Such is the quality of a true Vaishnava - being humble, having love for all, striving to get better each day, serving humanity and serving the Lord (and mother goddess Sri).
    jai hanuman gyan gun sagar jai kapis tihu lok ujagar

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    Re: What is Vaishnava ?

    Namaste
    Quote Originally Posted by Ram116040 View Post
    Namaste,

    In a post I started recently,we are discussing about the Smarta tradition.A Smarta individual's favorite deity maybe Sri Vishnu but he/she also worships other Vedic deities.Therefore, a Smarta Vaishnava is also a Vaishnava but unlike other Vishnu devotees of sectarian traditions, believes that other deities are equal to Sri Vishnu and honors them in his/her worship.
    It is a great insult to the Lord Vishnu to think that the gods (demigods such as Brahma, guna avatara Shiva, Indra, Vayu, Varuna, Yama, Surya, ... etc) are equal to Lord Vishnu. Vaishnava should never think they are equal, it is forbidden to think so in the scriptures and by itself the idea of them being equal has no support in the scriptures.

    yas tu nārāyaṇaṁ devaṁ
    brahma-rudrādi-daivataiḥ
    samatvenaiva vīkṣeta
    sa pāṣaṇḍī bhaved dhruvam

    yaḥ -- any person who; tu -- however; nārāyaṇam -- the Supreme Personality of Godhead, the master of such demigods as Brahmā and Śiva; devam -- the Lord; brahma -- Lord Brahmā; rudra -- Lord Śiva; ādi -- and others; daivataiḥ -- with such demigods; samatvena -- on an equal level; eva -- certainly; vīkṣeta -- observes; saḥ -- such a person; pāṣaṇḍī -- pāsaṇḍī; bhavet -- must be; dhruvam -- certainly.

    "A person who considers demigods like Brahmā and Śiva to be on an equal level with Nārāyaṇa is to be considered an offender, or pāṣaṇḍī." (Padma Purana)

    Here in this verse the word pāṣaṇḍī is applied, and means "atheist, a heretic". This is a verse from the Padma Purana quoted by early Gaudiya Vaishnava acaryas in the 16th century such as Sanatana Gosvami in his Hari-bhakti-vilāsa.

    Not only that one who thinks the gods are equal to Lord Vishnu is pāṣaṇḍī, an offender, or a heretic, but the idea of them being equal to Lord Vishnu (Krishna) has no support in the scriptures which can be easily seen from the Bhagavad gita and Upanishads.

    Bhagavad gita 11.37:

    kasmāc ca te na nameran mahātman
    garīyase brahmaṇo 'py ādi-kartre
    ananta deveśa jagan-nivāsa ...

    - garīyase brahmaṇo "O my Lord Krishna you are greater even than god Brahmā"! (garīyase -- who are better; brahmaṇaḥ -- than Brahmā);
    - deveśa "O ruler of the gods"! (deva-īśa: deva -- gods; īśa -- ruler, lord)

    Bhagavad gita 10.15:

    svayam evātmanātmānaḿ
    vettha tvaḿ puruṣottama
    bhūta-bhāvana bhūteśa
    deva-deva jagat-pate

    - puruṣottama "O greatest of all persons"
    - deva-deva "O Lord of all demigods" or "God of gods"!
    - jagat-pate "O Lord of the entire universe"

    The Upanishads also confirm that gods are not equal, but there is only one supreme among them and He is their lord and chief:

    Svetasvatara Upanishad 6.7 says:

    tam īśvarāṇāṃ paramaṃ maheśvaraṃ taṃ devatānāṃ paramaṃ ca daivatam
    patiṃ patīnāṃ paramaṃ parastād vidāma devaṃ bhuvaneśam īḍyam

    "Let us know that highest great lord of lords, the highest deity of deities, the master of masters, the highest above, as god, the lord of the world, the adorable."

    Here we have that there is a God who is the highest great lord of lords, and the highest deity (God) among other deities or gods (devatānāṃ). This is further confirmed in the following verse 6.8: na tat-samaś cābhyadhikaś ca dṛśyate "no one is greater than Him or equal to Him". So it must be that there is a God who is lord even of other gods!

    Maha Narayana Upanishad (translation by Swami Vimalananda with English and Sanskrit) explicitly says that Lord Vishnu is chief among all other gods (devas):

    śrīrme bhajatu alakṣmīrme naśyatu ।
    viṣṇumukhā vai
    devāśchandobhirimāॅṃllokānanapajayyamabhyajayan ...

    "May Sri favour me. May Alakshmi connected with me and mine be destroyed. The gods having Vishnu for their chief ..."
    (Maha Narayana Upanishad I-48)

    So what we see above is that Padma Purana and Bhagavad gita are just repeating the same points which are stated in the Shruti texts, Svetasvatara Upanishad and Maha Narayana Upanishad, and elsewhere.
    No vaishnava should think otherwise. It is forbidden to think contrary to the above clear and explicit statements of the scriptures.


    regards

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