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Thread: Why are ISKCON so obsessed with money?

  1. #1
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    Why are ISKCON so obsessed with money?

    Some guys from the local ISKCON centre have been operating a stall at university for Clubs Week. They've been giving away Krishna prasadam and "selling" their books for a donation. I've chatted to a couple of them, and one of them invited me to a "Gita workshop" tonight at their centre in town (their temple is quite a way out of the main city of Wellington).

    So I turn up at the upstairs office lot that they use, and they ask me for $10 to go to the class! He'd never said anything about that! Well, I didn't have any cash on me, just an bank card and my bus pass. When I told them I only had a bank card, the devotee I'd talked to said that I could go and get some money out from an ATM later.

    Well, after the class, they did the usual routine of distributing food. I asked the devotee I'd talked to if they'd be a charge for the food, and he said I still had to pay for attending the class. I told him that I didn't have any income at the moment and wouldn't be getting any until next Thursday. He then said it was all right and I could have some food. We chatted while we ate and he told me that I shouldn't worship Durga and worship Krishna instead.

    Has anyone else encountered this with ISKCON -charging to attend services? I personally think that it's wrong and I won't be going back there ever again. I mean, it's one thing to have a donation box or pass a plate around during a service, but it's another to charge admission. Could you imagine churches charging people to come to their Sunday services? They're already losing people rapidly, and charging admission would just drive more people away.

    They seem to be preoccupied with money - soliciting donations, selling books, and now this?

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    Re: Why are ISKCON so obsessed with money?

    Dear Scott,

    Looks like you are entering in to a place where they do not make you happy. You better stop going there and also do not waste your time going there unless you believe that they will change their ways of running the temple with your advice.

    But, with out money it is not possible to run anything like a temple etc. So, do not propose a theory where you will propagate a dream of having temple etc with out money. If temples are not necessary for you, stay far away from going to temples and save your peace of mind as well as theirs. If you think, it gives you any sort of benefit by going to the temple, worshiping the form of God there, do not complain so much about them seeking some sort of support to maintain such temples. Your $10 is not going to move you out of life but it can make a big difference to them. Do not generalize this as some sin and isolate it as just ISKCON practice.

    If your complaint have to be taken as some sort of sin, then every Hundi in the temples, every FREE prasadam offered has to canceled in all the temples. Instead you stay home and practice your spiritual process instead of complaining so much so many times. Did they print some invitation and invited you specially to loot your valuable money? If the answer is NO, be pleased with that.

    Your barber might be charging you more than $10 for an insignificant hair cut!

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    Re: Why are ISKCON so obsessed with money?

    Quote Originally Posted by grames View Post
    Dear Scott,

    Looks like you are entering in to a place where they do not make you happy. You better stop going there and also do not waste your time going there unless you believe that they will change their ways of running the temple with your advice.

    But, with out money it is not possible to run anything like a temple etc. So, do not propose a theory where you will propagate a dream of having temple etc with out money. If temples are not necessary for you, stay far away from going to temples and save your peace of mind as well as theirs. If you think, it gives you any sort of benefit by going to the temple, worshiping the form of God there, do not complain so much about them seeking some sort of support to maintain such temples. Your $10 is not going to move you out of life but it can make a big difference to them. Do not generalize this as some sin and isolate it as just ISKCON practice.

    If your complaint have to be taken as some sort of sin, then every Hundi in the temples, every FREE prasadam offered has to canceled in all the temples. Instead you stay home and practice your spiritual process instead of complaining so much so many times. Did they print some invitation and invited you specially to loot your valuable money? If the answer is NO, be pleased with that.

    Your barber might be charging you more than $10 for an insignificant hair cut!
    If I had a regular income I'd be happy to contribute to my local temple (NOT the ISKCON one). People will donate if given the opportunity. But I really resent being charged, especially when I really don't have a lot of money at the moment.

    Churches manage to get by without charging admission. The parishioners happily donate their money to the church. But the church doesn't penalize those who are too poor to contribute by requiring them to pay just to attend a service.

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    Re: Why are ISKCON so obsessed with money?

    Dear Scott,

    I am sorry if i am touching anything very personal about you or your current status of life. Sometimes we have to compromise about our current environment and yet, strive to see how we can progress and get detached. I am glad you have the heart to donate to temples and it doesn't have to be ISKCON. But, if you do not want ISKCON as your choice for various reasons, my only wonder is why are you going there repeatedly then? You already have a mind fixed that it is not your plate of things and not your choice of place. Why bother? Be it good or bad but its not fitting you right. What is the point in building the tower of complaints?

    Also try to know why churches are not charged? Does that mean they are running all the churches with out Money? Or does that mean they have enough money supplied to them through various channels and keep them worry free about running the chruch and give you things for FREE? What is free in this material world? Even water is nowadays charged with a bill. Except Air, everything else have a price tag.

    Am i justifying price tag for spiritual practice and wisdom? Please do not assume that as i am one of those who believe that, you give free what you got for free. But, the media, temple, satSang etc. etc. cannot be done with out managing the money aspect and i am sure you also understand that. Forcing someone to pay a certain amount for everything is stupidity and i do concur with you on that. But, do not generalize it and if possible, put a title saying Why the ISKCON temple in (city),Malaysia charge me for attending a Gita class etc. Also you have all your right to talk to the temple president if you have genuine interest to just attend the class and also explain your situation of why you cannot pay for it. Let us all know what their responses are instead of a generalized complaint.

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    Re: Why are ISKCON so obsessed with money?

    Scott,

    Looking at your posts, you seem like a bright young man. This particular post is out of character for you and totally unnecessary. Expressing yourself when you are angry, is always the wrong time. If I feel that a wrong has been done to me, I always let the poison of the moment dissolve itself before I react. And later on, the reaction always comes out to be more thought out and not that harsh.

    It is understandable that you being a student have no source of income and cannot afford to spend what you don't have. But in real life, everything costs money and somebody has to pay for it, preferably the user of that service or merchandise. As you narrate the incident, the devotee (in his moment of enthusiasm probably) forgot to mention the fee involved for the Gita lesson. They should have let it go at that and not charged you anything. But a harsh over-reaction accusing ISKCON of being money hungry is unwarranted. They have been at the forefront of building so many temples in India and around the world. They are also the ones who can communicate with the second generation NRIs in the language of their adopted country and keep them grounded. Every Hindu organization should be encouraged and supported for spreading the peaceful message of Bhagwad Gita and NEVER ridiculed.

    I am sure that you have cooled down, and probably repent being so harsh. It is perfectly normal and part of the learning process when you are young. I would use this experience as a lesson to improve myself and ask for Krishna's forgiveness. Path to spirituality is through humility and self-surrender. Why not put it to practice starting today?

    Regards.

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    Re: Why are ISKCON so obsessed with money?

    Quote Originally Posted by Believer View Post

    It is understandable that you being a student have no source of income and cannot afford to spend what you don't have. But in real life, everything costs money and somebody has to pay for it, preferably the user of that service or merchandise. As you narrate the incident, the devotee (in his moment of enthusiasm probably) forgot to mention the fee involved for the Gita lesson. They should have let it go at that and not charged you anything. But a harsh over-reaction accusing ISKCON of being money hungry is unwarranted.
    I have read of many instances where ISKCON devotees misrepresented themselves in order to solicit donations. These practices are known as "scamkirtan", a play on the word "sankirtan" which normally means congregational chanting, but in ISKCON jargon has been adapted to mean soliciting donations and distributing books. The process is described in books such as Monkey on a Stick and Where is Joey? Lost Among the Hare Krishnas. A common tactic is to offer a person a "free book" and then ask for a donation for the printing cost. This is to get around laws that prohibit selling in certain areas.

    They have been at the forefront of building so many temples in India and around the world. They are also the ones who can communicate with the second generation NRIs in the language of their adopted country and keep them grounded. Every Hindu organization should be encouraged and supported for spreading the peaceful message of Bhagwad Gita and NEVER ridiculed.
    I disagree with you saying that ISKCON are the ones that can communicate with the NRIs and keep them grounded. While ISKCON services are generally in English, they are introducing these NRIs to one sect of Hinduism (Gaudiya Vaishnavism) and telling them that other Hindu sects and philosophies (such as Saivism or Advaita) are wrong. In most cases, the NRIs will have been brought up as either non-sectarian Hindus or following a different sect than ISKCON. Hinduism Today (October 1998) reported that some Hindus who joined ISKCON were taught to reject their family's religion and adopt ISKCON beliefs and practices. If I was a parent, I would not want my children being taught by ISKCON devotees that Durga Ma is a demigod and lower than Krishna.

  7. #7

    Re: Why are ISKCON so obsessed with money?

    Wow, no I've never seen or heard of them charging for classes. The most I've encountered is them asking for small donations for the food they give you. Generally they are very giving. Maybe that particular temple of group is having serious financial problem?
    "For a bewildered person in the materialistic way of life, the body, the mind and the senses, which are engaged in sense gratification, are the cause of bondage to repeated birth, death, old age and disease. But for one who is advanced in spiritual knowledge, the same body, senses and mind are the cause of liberation"
    Prabhupada.

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    Re: Why are ISKCON so obsessed with money?

    Vannakkam:

    In my limited experience, I have observed a change in ISKCON. Sure there was a time that I met some ISKCON chaps dressed in suits soliciting money in the guise of 'international charity' but sheesh that was 25 years ago. My latest interactions, albeit few in number have been quite positive.

    In my city the Rathayatra (sp?) festival goes past another temple where they stop and lunch is served. Any individual has the choice to worship at any temple they wish. If they don't like what is offered, they can worship at home. I think people who are concerned about what happens with people at a temple forget what a temple is: Its the Home of the Deity, not the home of the people. Are you there to watch people, and have a discussion, or are you there to worship God?

    I strongly believe in Hindu Solidarity, so ISKCONites are my brothers and sisters in SD. Even though we may disagree on some subtle or even important stuff, that should be overridden by the fact its all Hinduism.

    I just don't see the point in criticising other sects or sampradayas or organisations that happen to hold a different point of view than mine. Its detrimental to all involved.

    Aum Namasivaya

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    Re: Why are ISKCON so obsessed with money?

    Quote Originally Posted by ScottMalaysia View Post
    While ISKCON services are generally in English, they are introducing these NRIs to one sect of Hinduism (Gaudiya Vaishnavism) and telling them that other Hindu sects and philosophies (such as Saivism or Advaita) are wrong.
    Scott,

    I understand your position and I respect your opinion about everything you say. Having been involved with them for a number of years and knowing the inner workings of that institution, I find it hard to refute most of what you say. All I am requesting is not to go on a bashing spree. After all, it is a hindu organization, and God knows we need every hindu organization to be propagating the peaceful message of the Bhagwat Gita. Every subset of hinduism worships a particular deity, almost to the total exclusion of the rest. So they are all at fault, not just the ISKCON (for their exclusive dedication to Gaudiya Vaishanava sampradya). If you have had a bad experience with them, or they just bring out the WORST in you because of something they do, just don't go there. But, there is no positive cause served by all the negativity expressed. Live and let live!

    Quote Originally Posted by Eastern Mind
    I think people who are concerned about what happens with people at a temple forget what a temple is: Its the Home of the Deity, not the home of the people. Are you there to watch people, and have a discussion, or are you there to worship God?

    I strongly believe in Hindu Solidarity, so ISKCONites are my brothers and sisters in SD. Even though we may disagree on some subtle or even important stuff, that should be overridden by the fact its all Hinduism.


    I just don't see the point in criticising other sects or sampradayas or organisations that happen to hold a different point of view than mine. Its detrimental to all involved.
    EM,

    I regret to say that you don't know all about the practices of ISKCON, and are also infusing 'your views" into the discussion rather than staying focused on "their views". Please don't digress from the subject.

    I fully support the view that in spite of our differences/dislikes of certain institutions, we should not be criticizing them just because we had a negative experience with them or they do/believe in something we don't agree with. After all, they are out there promoting Vedic/Hindu values. We should always be supporting of them, as we should be of each other in this forum.

    Regards.

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    Re: Why are ISKCON so obsessed with money?

    Quote Originally Posted by Believer View Post

    EM,

    I regret to say that you don't know all about the practices of ISKCON, and are also infusing 'your views" into the discussion rather than staying focused on "their views". Please don't digress from the subject.

    Regards.
    Vannakkam Believer; yes, I know I know very little. So what was it in my post that showed my ignorance? The part about the temple being the House of the Lord? I don't usually even participate in the ISKCON forums at all because of my ignorance, but I wanted to show support for Hindu brethen. Nothing more, really.

    Aum

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