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Thread: Decipherment of the Indus Valley Script

  1. #11
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    Re: Decipherment of the Indus Valley Script

    Dear Shivsomashekar


    If you consider yourself as the final authority, be happy with the same.

    However if you have some distance to go till you achieve that vaunted position, I would suggest you to study as a apart of your research the following :

    1. The books of David Frawley and others in respect to Aryan / Dravidian.

    People in North India are normally lighter skinned than south India which is out of normal process of climate. It is a general phenomenon as one moves from equator to pole.

    2. The DNA study on the flow of humans to this sub-continent. It debunks both - Aryan invasion and the percieved divide Aryan / Dravidian

    3. As regarding Gulf of Cambay look for it in Google - you will find it. I was part of the Institute which carried out the study.

    I hope the researcher in you will take interest in finding out these facts.

    Added some sites of interest :

    http://new.modernrationalist.com/201...of-s-m-khodke/
    http://www.archaeologyonline.net/art...n-history.html
    http://www.sabha.info/research/aif.html
    http://archaeology.about.com/od/indu...s/a/aryans.htm
    http://clubs.ncsu.edu/hsc/hsc/Events...eb_21_2007.pdf
    http://indiatoday.intoday.in/story/i.../1/163645.html
    http://www.east-west-dichotomy.com/s...3-max-mueller/
    http://www.stephen-knapp.com/solid_e...n_invasion.htm
    http://www.scientificamerican.com/ar...tory-of-humans
    http://www.dnaindia.com/india/report...theory_1623744
    http://home.iitk.ac.in/~amman/articles/DNAbased.html
    http://www.archaeologyonline.net/artifacts/cambay.html
    http://www.ancientworlds.net/aw/Article/1099190
    http://www.grahamhancock.com/forum/B...ryanB1.php?p=1
    Last edited by kallol; 15 March 2013 at 03:53 AM.
    Love and best wishes:hug:

  2. #12

    Re: Decipherment of the Indus Valley Script

    Quote Originally Posted by kallol View Post
    Dear Shivsomashekar

    If you consider yourself as the final authority, be happy with the same.
    The authority has to be a qualified source, as will be explained shortly.

    1. The books of David Frawley and others in respect to Aryan / Dravidian.
    Frawley is an expert in Ayurveda and Chinese medicine. He has no background in history. Just like I would not go to my auditor for a back problem, I would not go to an Ayurveda expert to learn history (neither should you).

    Else any T, D and H, regardless of his background can write all kinds of nonsense, pass it off as history and we will choose and reject based on how closely their writings match our own preconceived ideas - which is what you appear to be doing in this case by taking Frawley seriously and rejecting the work of qualified historians.

    2. The DNA study on the flow of humans to this sub-continent. It debunks both - Aryan invasion and the percieved divide Aryan / Dravidian
    It is 2013 folks. Can we please move past this "Aryan Invasion" propoganda? No one is claiming an invasion. The theory is one of migration and unless you reject the "out of Africa" position, then you have admit that Indians came from *somewhere else* and were not magically created out of nothing.

    3. As regarding Gulf of Cambay look for it in Google - you will find it. I was part of the Institute which carried out the study.
    Excellent. But the links I see are not pointing to the pre-iceage date of 13000 BC you provided. Instead, I see a piece of wood was dated to about 7000 BC and the finding was dismissed as inconclusive as there is no indication that this wood was shaped by humans. A coast line sinking is not an uncommon phenomenon (Mahabalipuram, etc) and has happened all over the world.

    If you have a specific link, please point it out. The links I found are here and neither of them endorse your claim -
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marine_...Gulf_of_Cambay
    http://theness.com/neurologicablog/i...ity-of-cambay/

    Stephen Knapp is a Hare Krishna, Graham Hancock is a master of conspiracy theories (for those who do not know, he claimed the Great Pyramid was built by Atlanteans or space people(?) before the ice age). All your sources have one or both of these two things in common -

    1. Lack of evidence to support their claims.
    2. Ideological motivation.

    Such dubious sources gain popularity for the sole reason that they pander to the crowd; providing fantasy and entertainment value in place of facts and logic. We have a section of Indians who will prefer the version of history provided by an Electrician or Ayurvedic or Radiologist over that of academic history, so long as the Electrician or Ayurvedic or Radiologist is willing to provide fantastically old dates for Indian scriptures and even better if he says the entire world civilization started in India.

    If you will make extraordinary claims such as the existence of pre-iceage civilizations, evolution of tamil into sanskrit, etc., you should do better than this. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence and so far you have not offered any.

    Once again, no one is claiming an Aryan invasion. It is about finding a meaningful answer for the striking similarities in ancient Latin, Sanskrit, ancient Greek and ancient Persian. It is about explaining the differences between IVC, the Vedic culture and Hinduism. A meaningful answer has to be based on facts and logic and not on wishful thinking such as it must all have started in my home country. If we will reject academic history because it that does not suit our own personal views, then it is perhaps best to stay away from the topic?

    I will look at the other links (non-Stephen Knapp, GH) and respond back.

    Thanks
    Last edited by shiv.somashekhar; 20 March 2013 at 08:57 PM.
    http://lokayata.info
    http://shivsomashekhar.wordpress.com/category/history/

  3. #13

    Re: Decipherment of the Indus Valley Script

    Have you read the links you posted? Knowingly or unknowingly, you have posted one that actually supports the Aryan migration theory!

    ...This study also indicates that the upper castes of both North and South India have much closer affinities with central Asian populations. The lower castes seem to be earlier entrants and the upper castes later entrants into their regions. The upper castes of North India, however, seem to have come in much later than those of South India. The differences between castes is much more sharp in the south than in the north.

    http://home.iitk.ac.in/~amman/articles/DNAbased.html
    http://lokayata.info
    http://shivsomashekhar.wordpress.com/category/history/

  4. #14
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    Re: Decipherment of the Indus Valley Script

    Dear Shiv,

    I am happy that you have won the debate.

    I have no intention to change your mind.

    However said, I, as a scientist, have also the right to have my judgement. It might be wrong however the position has been created by information, analysis, common sense, history, native scriptural knowledge, Hinduism vis a vis science, etc.

    Wish you a happy journey of knowledge.
    Love and best wishes:hug:

  5. #15
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    Re: Decipherment of the Indus Valley Script

    Quote Originally Posted by reort
    I want to know more. I checked out some of your links.
    I wrote a post there, but it was not approved by the moderators (when will I not require moderator approval for posting?)

    Anyways, my question was, something like, what do you think of certain populations which are classified as 'Australoid'? I think they are found in Central India, like MP-Orissa-WB-Jharkhand area.

    I also agree with certain points you have raised there. The classification of 'races' already implies competition, and isn't it natural for some people to cheat?
    From whatever I have learnt, I can only provide partial answer and a pointer towards some possibilities.

    1. There are certain questions unanswered in the evolution of human. If the evolution is a continuous process, then why do not we see the same evolution process in different stages right from the caves. Say if chimpanzee is our starting point, then we should see the next stage, and the next stage even now. It should be a continuous process. It should not be such that it has happened and stopped now. This means there are missing links. The missing links are possible mixture of two different mamals of same category.
    2. This leads to the possibility that different species of human had been our starting point - we know one - Neanderthals. There may be few more (not sure). These species mixing at different locations gave rise to different lineages.
    3. Again if we follow the DNA trail then we will find that the movement to Australia has been through India. So what is known today as Australoid should have some parts from India.
    4. Another folly we do generally is limiting the human existence and their activities to whatever we have discovered. Though it seems the natural route but it has its limitations as most of the physical artifacts are perishable. Even then the the dynamics of discoveries change the history every other day. DNA analysis goes beyond that. The kinds of weapons or technologies the epic point towards have mesmerised the modern day scientists. With the advancement of science as we expand our knowledge domain, the more and more respect we develop for our scriptures as the science strengthens the knowledge of our scriptures. This is a pointer towards how advance the so call rishis (spiritual scientists ) have been.

    There is lot we do not know so coming to any conclusion is absurdity
    Love and best wishes:hug:

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