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Thread: More Pointless debate here

  1. #11

    Re: God(s)

    Quote Originally Posted by Sudarshan
    But this is the exact problem. If the disciple had a problem of mental conception of the divine, it was better to teach him something different to bring him to the level, a point thoroughly missed by all monists. The guru need not repeat the same monotonous teaching to everybody. The first standard student and the post graduate student are never taught the same lessons, and that does not mean the first standard student is ever cheated by his teacher.

    You are probably unaware that VA is much closer to monism than dualism in essence. But it rarely ever teaches its part of monism in a big way because most people are not prepared to even bear this, and certain questions can be answered satisfactorily only by dualism. With practical considerations in mind, Vishsitadvaita emphasis only the seSha-seShi bhava, or that which teaches that jiva is a dependent(servant) of God. It makes a person quickly loose his ego, if he considers himself a servant of God. Of course, I understand that jIva is much more than a servant in mukti. But the dAsya bhAva is a very powerful means of God realization.

    The fact that most religions preach only pure dualism must stand in proof that most people are qualified only for that. They have to be afraid of God, fight, kill and be divisive in order to reach the higher flights of philsophical truth where there is an organic unity of existance. That is the play of God, or so it seems.
    I have read about an interesting encounter between Sri Shankaracharya and his param Guru Gaudapada.

    Sri Shankaracharya had triumphantly won a debate somewhere and was on his way to Utkal (modern orrisa) when he met gaudapada. He prostrated before the venerable old man and told him that with gaudapada's blessing he has been able to defeat bouddha vada in north india and made advaita triumphant. He said that he desires to seek his blessings and spend some time discussing advaita with him, before continuing on the journey to establish advaita throughout India. Sri Gaudapada smiled at this and said that Sri Shankara may still have some thing to learn about advaita. Hearing these words from his venerable param guru Shankara realized that he was perhaves a little to arrogant in front of his own param guru on advaita. He humbly asked for Gaudapada's openion on the matter. gaudapada said that if Shankara had indeed realized the advaita then he wouldn't have to speak to gaudapada as you for the both of them were one. That he regarded gaudapada as a seperate entity from himslef suggest his own realization was still in the realm of dvaita. This made shankaracharya reflect deeply. He took gadapada's blessings and proceeded to Utkal.

    The crux of this story as explained is, that advaita is the final aim of the spirtual journey and throught the whole path dvaita can only be the mental conception of God which a sadhak can follow. Otherwise advaitins cannot even do upasana. W/o upasana and work nothing can happen. The entire science of Upasana (whether pure devotional or Yogic) is based on dvaita. One cannot worship thinking himself to be God. Gaudapada gently reminded Shankara that his own philosphy is the final goal which Shankara himself had not yet attained.

    My little knowledge tells be that most monist leanages understand this. Otherwise shaktas won't worship shakti and hold devotion to Goddess so high and Monist Shaiva's wouldn't pray to Shiva!!!
    The intellectual advaita vedantin is perhaves a modern concept and a mordern phenominan. Shankara didn't do that ~ on contrary he established worship of various Gods and goddesses in his mathas and he united many theistic sects under one umbrella. He himself is known to be Tara upasak like Buddha.

    Modern intellectual vedantin started only a century or so ago if I'm not wrong.

  2. #12
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    Admin Note

    I have moved the pointless my dad can beat up your dad kind of debate here. Please continue...I have other better things to worry about...

    Sudarshan, I have no idea what you are talking about...shiva, brahman, advaita, VA...I have no clue where you are coming from and why you started talking about this. I have no time to continue with this. sorry...

    :6804382843:

    thanks,
    satay

  3. #13
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    Re: More Pointless debate here

    Deva-ine does not equal benign, particularly to the rational mind.


    ZN

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