How do we know if we are having a genuine vision of God, and not the misfiring of an overly emotional brain?
How do we know if we are having a genuine vision of God, and not the misfiring of an overly emotional brain?
Vannakkam Rudy: Good question, and I have no answer. On the rare occasion it happens or has happened to me, I usually go with the former, but maybe I'm just being emotionally optimistic. I don't see how there could ever be a really objective way of telling.
Aum Namasivaya
नमस्ते,
I agree. I don't see that there is a way to tell the difference, or perhaps there is even no difference. Maybe God appears to you by making your brain fire in a different way, thereby creating a vision. Who cares?
It isn't even the visions that matter. They just encourage you along the path, but it's not good to become too focused on the experiences, whether visions, sensations, sounds, etc. What matters is the love you have for God within your heart, and the fire of your devotion.
ॐ नमः शिवाय
I thought the point of Bhakti Yoga was to have a vision of God. What is the goal? I know God realization but I do not know how that manifests in Bhakti Yoga.
नमस्ते,
I would say that the vision is only a nice side-effect, akin to meditative experiences—nice but not necessary, and potentially distracting.
Again, is not the purpose of devotion to love God even more and more? When I do devotion, it is not to have an experience, but it is because it is the obvious thing to do—to love God and devote myself to God. God blesses me greatly and gives me grace in one way or another, but this is not my purpose of devotion. Ideally, we should do all things for love of God, then all things will be holy.
Perhaps you should ask yourself why you do bhakti?
ॐ नमः शिवाय
Well one day I want to know God personaly as much as safely possible, I want Him to respond back... I know that I am saying "want" a lot there, but it is were I'm at right now.Perhaps you should ask yourself why you do bhakti?
I would like Shiva to say "hi" back.
The reason why I want (there it is again) to personally know Shiva is like why would I want to know my parents.
Maybe this is just a carry over from a little while ago where I was an agnostic, I crave certainty.
I crave a knowledge and a personal relationship with Shiva.
Does that make sense?
Vannakkam Rudy: I think there are several purposes of bhakti. One is just to soften the intellect, add stillness, calm, humility and other qualities to a subconscious mind that may be hardened. I never go looking for mystical experiences like you describe. That's why I said in other thread they come unbidden. If it happens it happens. If it doesn't it doesn't. So I'm with Aum Namah Sivaya on this.
Aum Namasivaya
It appears I just had one of those "Learning experiences".
I must honestly thank you. For all my reading I seemed to of not learned to not search for religious experiences. I just did not know for some reason (but hey thats the reason I'm on this forum)
Namaste Rudy,
I agree with the previous replies as well; I am adding my voice here
simply because I identified myself as an agnostic for a long time, before
hearing Maa's call.
Please consider this: as much as rationalism is of benefit in navigating
the physical world, when one is attempting to enter the path of bhakti,
expectations and preconceptions must be seen for the obstacles they are.
Attempts to impose rules, or some personal framework of acceptance or rejection
will only meet with frustration and a lack of progress- it is akin to saying
"I would like some tomato soup, but only if it is served on a skewer."
If you wish to draw closer to Lord Shiva, be first willing to accept His terms, and don't forget-
Lord Ganesha, His son, is the Remover of obstacles
JAI MATA DI
|| जय माता की ||
नमस्ते,
You want Śiva to say hi—that is great. It is great you want a personal relationship with Him. However, it seems you are seeking these things through visions and religious experiences.
It is not that Śiva is not saying hi, and not wanting to have a personal relationship with you, but because you are not hearing Him. YOu want Him to come through dramatically, a booming voice in the clouds and all that, and that's not really how it is.
One of the things I love about Hindus is how they see God everywhere. I was reading a thread the other day where someone thought a carrot resembled Ganesha, and so they kept it on their altar. That's just such a beautiful love that I aim to model in my own life.
Śiva whispers; Śiva does not yell. YOu must listen closely, watch closely, to catch a sound or a glimpse of Him. He is more likely to speak within your own heart, rather than in a vision.
I understand the skepticism, but you have to lay that all down if you want to have a relationship with God. Your doubts will block that from happening. Look around you and see the way Śiva works in your life already.
ॐ नमः शिवाय
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