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Thread: Feminism and Hinduism

  1. #11
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    Re: Feminism and Hinduism

    "Feminism" in Shaktism and nonsense such as the aforementioned where women are specifically venerated as being Divine is very peculiar to Bengal region.”

    Namaste Kumar, Havent you ever heard of famous temples of :

    Kanchi Kamakshi
    Madhura Meenakshi and
    Kashi Vishalaxmi ??

    Not to mention various regional deities like, ellamma, mallamm, sunkeshulamma etc etc. Women are revered as deities by all hindus with temples built for female goddesses in many areas.Bengalis are no exception.
    Last edited by charitra; 14 April 2011 at 12:28 PM.

  2. #12

    Re: Feminism and Hinduism

    Quote Originally Posted by BryonMorrigan View Post
    And I might add, that I, a Gulf War Veteran, don't feel "emasculated" by worshiping Devi...nor do I feel that a woman should feel "oppressed" by praying to Vishnu or Shiva or whatever else form of God/Goddess that one prefers.
    The Goddess is not a (human) woman. She is female. But Her feminity is not to be compared with or equal to human feminity. It is an insult to reduce Her to human females. I depise worshipping human-womanhood not the Goddess.

    Same thing with Vaishnavism/Shaivism. Vishnu/Shiva is the "Supreme Father" in a sense that it is a term by which we adore. It does not mean there is something Divine about human males.

    Leave the anti-woman rhetoric to the Christians and Muslims... I have no use for it.
    Saying that I don't want to worship women is not being anti-woman.

  3. #13

    Re: Feminism and Hinduism

    KD:

    Part of what is liberating about SD is that it treats the universe itself as God. God in Hinduism, unlike in Abrahamic faiths, is not a value detached from the creation. The universe is what we acknowledge when we "worship".

    So even though the divinity of Shakti's femininity may not be the same as that of the femininity of an earthly human female, "worship" of the human female is not "heresy". Worship of nothing is heresy.

    Having said that, I would like to know what is the difference between the divine feminine and the earthly feminine.
    Vimoh's blog and Twitter

  4. #14

    Re: Feminism and Hinduism

    I feel emasculate about worshipping a woman. Just as I feel inferior worshipping someone else for example a male boss. Worship means submission, helplessness and inferiority.

    Worshipping anything apart from God/or anything that relates to God(Guru) always will mean that you will lose something. Always you will lose intelligence and dignity.

    You will never be able to surpass anything that you (genuinely) worship even if you could.

    Feminism due to Goddess worship is an absurdity and definitely heresy.

    Do you see Vaishnavas and Shaivas claim "masculinity"? Do you ever hear them say "in my biological father I see Lord Vishnu/Lord Shiva"? or that "men who are fathers are a manifestation of Vishnu/Shiva"? Nope.

    But you see some people claiming some type of a reflection of the Goddess in women.

  5. #15

    Re: Feminism and Hinduism

    Okay now you get to the core of the matter.

    Yes, I have heard Vaishnavas and Shaivas compare their fathers to Vishnu and Shiva. Your assertion that they don't is simply wrong. People get compared to Rama and Krishna with great frequency.

    This emasculated nonsense is of your own making. It does not reflect Hindu thought. And your opposition is to "worship" of women alone, not worship in general. So I assume there is at least some amount of sexism there.

    Worship is just a word. To you it means accepting subjugation and inferiority. To me it means acknowledgment of value. Plenty of Vedic hymns just praise deities without saying that the person is inferior.

    Your view is very Abrahamic. Try to be more Hindu.
    Vimoh's blog and Twitter

  6. #16

    Re: Feminism and Hinduism

    The same people who try to connect Feminism with Shaktism are the same people who not only denounce caste system (not even from just a practical pov - one could speak about the treatment of all devotees as equal yet believe in a form of a division of society for function of it by allocating occupation based on the inherent nature which qualifies them such as in Shri Vaishnavism where even Shudras are accepted to perform certain rituals) but a total denouncement and chastisement of it. Hence technically it opposes Vedic orthodoxy.

    I was never saying anything about the Goddess Herself nor Shaktism. Shaktism is a Vedic religion.

    People seem to be mixing my opposition to "Feminism" with Shaktism. What an irony!

    Quote Originally Posted by BryonMorrigan View Post
    Considering the fact that even Conservative Hinduism treats women's rights better than Christianity or Islam, I'd say yes.

    ...and then there are Shaktas (like me) who believe in treating every woman with great respect, as you would your mother.

    Striyah devah, Striyah pranah: "Women are Devas, women are life itself."
    Females(human) are not the Goddess. Just as Jivas are not the Devas.

    I follow the scriptures. Whatever they contain are on purpose for reasons.

    The Devi Bhagavata Purana is a principle text of Shaktism. So shall we take a look at it?

    It is said that upon initially encountering Durga, Mahishasura underestimated her, thinking: "How can a woman kill me, Mahishasur—the one who has defeated the trinity of gods?" However, Durga roared with laughter, which caused an earthequake which made Mahishasur aware of her powers.

    And the terrible Mahishasura rampaged against her, changing forms many times. First he was a buffalo demon, and she defeated him with her sword. Then he changed forms and became an elephant that tied up the goddess's lion and began to pull it towards him. The goddess cut off his trunk with her sword. The demon Mahishasur continued his terrorizing, taking the form of a lion, and then the form of a man, but both of them were gracefully slain by Durga.
    We see that Mahishasura (an asura is the most ignorant form of creature) undermines the Goddess and insults Her as a woman.

    The Goddess laughs in response. And does something which shows Her powers to him. In other words she passes off what he says in a way that points his stupidity and proceeds to correct him by making him aware of Her true identity(i.e Her Supremacy).

    AFAIK there is no such a story in any Vaishnava Purana or Shaiva Purana. Nothing that would suggest that Vishnu or Shiva are considered superior mistakenly based upon them being males for which a correction is made.

    The understanding here is that the asura thinks that he having beaten the males Gods could defintely take the female because he relates the situation of creatures to the Gods (where males are physically superior to females). That is where his stupidity lies and is his fatal flaw.

  7. #17

    Re: Feminism and Hinduism

    You digress KD.

    The questions are simple.

    1) What is the distinction you are making between Shakta worship of the feminine?
    2) Why does worship of the feminine makes you feel emasculated?

    Do you realise that when people say a woman represents the Shakta feminine, they are referring to an ideal? Same way the goddess is an ideal?

    Feminism is also am acknowledgment of the woman as an idea. Not of woman as an organism.
    Vimoh's blog and Twitter

  8. #18
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    Re: Feminism and Hinduism

    Feminism was necessary to develop in the west, since western culture was highly influenced by Judeo-Christian thinking. The sole reason most Meditaranian people, both Jewish and Christian, are often very macho and chauvinistic is because the influence of the Bible. Feminism has brought a lot of good things, but like the early postsers in this thread mentioned, feminism can mean different things. It can mean standing for equal rights for women in education and the job market, but in can also stand for those bitter women who want all men to be castrated completely. That's why I think the word feminism is quite meaningless. I don't know why in the west everything has to be turned into an "-ism." Even something simple as consuming a meatless diet is turned into vegetarian-"ism." I believe that the male and female principles are both very important in this universe, a lot of Hindus have learned to always invoke the female counterpart of a god before worshipping the male. Sometimes men have a more feminin side and women have a more masculine side, so feminine and masculin principles are not as black and white as secundairy and primairy sex charesteristics. Many devoted saints would say that bhakti is a very feminine trait. I don't agree that the ideal is that everyone should become a hermaphrodite like some feminists would want or that all men should hand their balls over, but I do support a lot of the good work the feminist movement has brought here in the west.
    Last edited by Sahasranama; 15 April 2011 at 04:11 AM.

  9. #19

    Re: Feminism and Hinduism

    Hinduism is perhaps the only religion to encourage feminism, since it believes in the feminine aspect of the divine. At least in theory, it should be compatible with feminism. Even in Vaishnavism, Vishnu has many forms, and Mohini avatar is actually feminine and is not any less than other avatars.

  10. #20
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    Re: Feminism and Hinduism

    "Gender discrimination a cultural bias, not religious truth" by Pooja Deopura, a recent graduate of the University of California, Davis, now a software professional living in Fremont, and an Executive Council member of the Hindu American Foundation.

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