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Thread: angels

  1. #11
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    Re: angels

    Thank you EM, Yajvan, and Ganeshprasad for your detailed explanations. I think this should clarify things for both Jaggin and myself, while highlighting the importance of explaining the terms we use, since Hindus often speak different languages (both literally and otherwise).

  2. #12
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    Re: angels

    Quote Originally Posted by sanjaya View Post
    Sorry Atanu, I think what we have here is a difference in terminology. I have always heard of Brahma, Vishnu, Shiva, and the other Hindu gods referred to as devas. On the other hand, I know that the terminology I'm familiar with isn't the most popular one. For example, the first time I ever heard the term "asura" used to refer to demons was when I started looking up Hindu resources on the Internet.
    Namaste Sanjaya,

    No doubt the Deva term is used to depict Brahma, Vishnu, Shiva. But Mahadeva, Mahesvara, Parameshwara, Sarvesvara are also used for these Devas. All three are also referred as Eko. And many other names, some flattering and some not so flattering. But Eko Rishi He is. He is Devas and Asuras as well.

    SU III, 3-4
    i) 3. On all sides eye, on all sides face,
    on all sides arms, on all sides feet,
    he, God, the One, creates heaven and earth,
    forging them together with arms and wings.

    4. He who is source and origin of the Gods,
    the Lord of all, Rudra, the mighty sage,
    who produced in ancient days the Golden Germ (Hiranyagarbha)--
    may he endow us with purity of mind!
    Regarding Vishnu and Rudra:

    Rig Veda 10.191.3
    sa vishnu sa shiva sa rudra so'kshara sah
    Where the imperishable akshara is nirguna, un-nameble, Vishnu, Rudra and BrahmA are aspects of that impersishable. There are ample evidences that these are not three but are seen as three under different conditions. They all are called one without a second. Rudra and Vishnu are not two Devas;

    Shree Rudram

    oM namo bhagavate rudrAya vishhNave mR^ityurme pAhi |
    prANAnAM granthirasi rudro mA vishAntakaH |
    tenAnnenApyAyasva || 6||

    namo rudraaya vishhNave mR^ityurme pAhi
    agnaavishhNuu sajoshhasemaa vardhantu vaaM giraH |
    dyumnairvaajebhiraagatam

    My definition of Devas (gods) is based on the following scripture:

    Satapatha Brahmana Part IVFIFTH ADHYÂYA. FIRST BRÂHMANA.

    9:5:1:12 Now, then, the discussion of the Samishtayagus (oblations): The gods and the Asuras, both of them sprung from Pragâpati, entered upon their father Pragâpati's inheritance, to wit, speech--truth and untruth, both truth and untruth: they, both of them, spake the truth, and they both spake untruth; and, indeed, speaking alike, they were alike.

    9:5:1:13 The gods relinquished untruth, and held fast to truth, and the Asuras relinquished truth, and held fast to untruth.
    Only distinction between Asuras and Devas are their mode of speech; Truth or Untruth. Divine beings, not separated from the Atmic truth, shine by the light of Rudra-Bhargo:

    Yajur Veda: iv. 5. 9.
    p Homage to you, sparkling hearts of the gods
    On the other hand, asuras strive to shine by the ego. On this account Rudra is Asura also, because He is called self-resplendent, He shines by His own light. Similarly Vishnu is called self born; He is born of Himself. Gods (Devas) recieve oblations because they have not severed themselves from the Akshara. All oblations are for the akshara alone. Whereas, if one offered oblations to asuras that will not reach anywhere.

    I can go and on with scriptural evidences that Prajapati-Father, Vishnu, and Rudra are not mere Devas but directly the Akshara. But the following should be sufficient:

    He who is source and origin of the Gods
    the Lord of all (sarvesvara), Rudra, the mighty sage, -----------.
    .

    You will note that Lord Shri Krishna is also called Sarvesvara.


    Gandharvas and apsaras are closest to the angels of christianity.
    ------------------------------

    The Gods (Devas) are after Hiraynagarbha - the resplendent multiform creator. But Sarvesvara is prior to Hiranyagarbha. The Seer Rudra is transcendental.

    Om Namah Shivaya
    Last edited by atanu; 11 December 2009 at 11:48 PM.
    That which is without letters (parts) is the Fourth, beyond apprehension through ordinary means, the cessation of the phenomenal world, the auspicious and the non-dual. Thus Om is certainly the Self. He who knows thus enters the Self by the Self.

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