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Thread: evolution & hinduism

  1. #1
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    evolution & hinduism

    does evolution and hinduism mix? for example when the world was first created could the meditation not have lasted until humans were eventually formed? and then could we have not been animalistic until the conscious mind developed? leading to the birth of hinduism over 5000 years ago?

    side question totally unrelated to this: before i asked for suggestions of what books to read first. if i'm leaning towards vishnu as my supreme beings, would that make a more definitive direction to take?

  2. #2

    Re: evolution & hinduism

    Quote Originally Posted by connyxoberst View Post
    does evolution and hinduism mix? for example when the world was first created could the meditation not have lasted until humans were eventually formed? and then could we have not been animalistic until the conscious mind developed? leading to the birth of hinduism over 5000 years ago?

    side question totally unrelated to this: before i asked for suggestions of what books to read first. if i'm leaning towards vishnu as my supreme beings, would that make a more definitive direction to take?
    study vaishnava books such as the bhagavad gita, ramayana and mahabharata... you can find them at krishna.com

    namaste

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    Re: evolution & hinduism

    Although Hindu creation theory (chiefly in Srimd BhAgavatam) states that the gods were created first, then the worlds, man and only after that the animals, birds, and plants, Hinduism believes in evolution--not of the physical form but of the spirit, or rather the consciousness of the individual soul.

    The Hindu view of evolution takes into account the truth of reincarnation. Thus an individual soul takes birth among lakhs of physical forms and 'evolves' towards Self-Realization. When Hinduism says that man has six senses, the animal kingdom has just five and the vegetable kingdom less than that, what is meant is that the consciousness of the Self is veiled by various levels of density of matter--the smaller the number of senses, the less the channels of consciousness for the Self to assert itself.

    This is the reason that Hinduism regards human birth as the highest and most suitable for Self-Realization, and exhorts the humans towards it through 'shravaNa, manana, nididhyAsa' and satsangha (learning, chiefly through listening, contemplation of what is heard and read, meditation and keeping the company of the wise).
    रत्नाकरधौतपदां हिमालयकिरीटिनीम् ।
    ब्रह्मराजर्षिररत्नाढ्यां वन्दे भारतमातरम् ॥

    To her whose feet are washed by the ocean, who wears the Himalayas as her crown, and is adorned with the gems of rishis and kings, to Mother India, do I bow down in respect.

    --viShNu purANam

  4. #4

    Re: evolution & hinduism

    wanted to add that "lakhs" means "thousands"

    namaste

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    Re: evolution & hinduism

    Quote Originally Posted by connyxoberst View Post
    does evolution and hinduism mix? for example when the world was first created could the meditation not have lasted until humans were eventually formed? and then could we have not been animalistic until the conscious mind developed? leading to the birth of hinduism over 5000 years ago?

    side question totally unrelated to this: before i asked for suggestions of what books to read first. if i'm leaning towards vishnu as my supreme beings, would that make a more definitive direction to take?
    Namaste Connyx,

    Hinduism has no problem with theory of evolution. Let's first understand that the Truth is so complicated that it needs very high level of understanding .... because you have to try going beyond all concepts we know through our mind. Therefore, there are various theories within Hinduism to satisfy people having different level of understanding.

    The "Creation" & "Creator" theory is actually a very simplistic theory. You find the Truth in its closest form in Advait Vedanta. The Universe that we see has only relative existence in the form we see it & understand .... this existence is only relative to mind. Now without going into the complexity of the theory of Advait Vedanta, we have to understand that SELF is, was & will be always SELF ... even when human being was not born & when the dinosaurs ruled this earth & now when humans are ruling this earth & also when (if it happens) human being will be completely wiped out from this universe or evolves to a super being. It is not that this creation was for human beings only & everything started with these species alone .... it is all the expression of SELF in first two states ... sustained by the third state ... & all appearing on the Canvas of the fourth state of the SELF. So, the point before the Big Bang was SELF, this entire universe including the stars, the galaxies, the space, this earth & everything within is again the SELF & in future whatever will happen in this dream state is not going to change SELF.

    Hinduism has no clash with logic, science or historical truth, because Hindus have not only believed in just a theory but have experienced it & also offer that anyone can experience it. The logic & reasoning are the tools which help you understand the Truth ... Hinduism doesn't discourage their use but encourages it. Whatever is not logical, is anything but Truth.

    OM
    "Om Namo Bhagvate Vaasudevaye"

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    Re: evolution & hinduism

    Sanatan Dharma has answers to all questions a man has.
    Consider the Awatars of the God on the earth (as a process) as given in Purans (Vedas mention only Matsya awatar)
    1 Matsya awatar (Fish) - life evolved in water
    2 kachhapah awatar (Turtle) - a creature both water and land based
    3 Varaha awtar (Boar) - purely a land based creature
    4 narshing awatar (half man half animal)-
    5 vaman awatar (a dwarf man) - a small man so intelligent that with his wits he got all three worlds.
    6 Rama awatar- A perfect human being
    & Krishna awtar- Some say he was more perfect than Rama.

    Here it is. The evolution of the races.

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    Re: evolution & hinduism

    Namaste,

    Interesting rkpande, but these are incarnations of Lord Vishnu. I am trying to comprehend how this goes together with our physical evolution. Perhaps I am just not understanding correctly, please set me straight.

    -juan

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    Re: evolution & hinduism

    Quote Originally Posted by devotee View Post
    Namaste Connyx,

    Hinduism has no problem with theory of evolution. Let's first understand that the Truth is so complicated that it needs very high level of understanding .... because you have to try going beyond all concepts we know through our mind. Therefore, there are various theories within Hinduism to satisfy people having different level of understanding.

    Hinduism has no clash with logic, science or historical truth, because Hindus have not only believed in just a theory but have experienced it & also offer that anyone can experience it. The logic & reasoning are the tools which help you understand the Truth ... Hinduism doesn't discourage their use but encourages it. Whatever is not logical, is anything but Truth.

    OM

    let me just say thank you all for responding. i love everyones original view point on how it can coincide. the paragraphs i quoted above made most sense to me and it makes my heart even warmer to this.. this way of life. to use the word religion feels almost cheap because its so much more than that. i've always trusted in proven science and therefore evolution. yet another example of why christianity and every other religion left me so unsatisfied.

    rkpande
    what an interesting answer to my question. it really combines evolution with the notion that we are created in god's likeness.

    it seems to me that evolution and hinduism can and do fit together very nicely. as saidevo said, now we focus mainly on the spiritual evolution, how much we learn, how much control we have over ourselves, the process of reincarnation itsself. but it could be we started focusing on this once we stopped changing and evolving physically. after all primitive man was no better than the animals surrounding him. he was unable to speak let alone have the awareness needed for spiritual evolution.

    again another topic that uniquely hinduism acknowledges as truth, or possibility as truth, and does not call for blind faith and does not accuse science as being deceitful and evil.

  9. #9

    Re: evolution & hinduism

    Isha-Upanishad Mantra 16:
    "The killer of the soul, whoever he may be, must enter into the planets known as the worlds of the faithless, full of darkness and ignorance."

    Human life is distinguished from animal life due to its heavy responsibilities. Those who are cognizant of these responsibilities and who work in that spirit are called "suras" (those destined for Surya (Surya-Devathe Sun Deity, thus, the Sun planet), and those who are neglectful of these responsibilities or who have no information of them are called "asuras".

    Throughout the universe there are only these two types of human being. In the Rg Veda it is stated that the suras always aim at the lotus feet of the Supreme Lord Vishnu and act accordingly. Their ways are as illuminated as the path of the sun.
    Intelligent human beings must always remember that the soul obtains a human form after an evolution of many millions of years in the cycle of transmigration.

    The temporary material body is certainly a foreign dress. The Bhagavad-gita (Chap 2 verse 20) clearly says that after the destruction of the material body the living entity is not annihilated, nor does he lose his identity.

    The identity of the living entity is never impersonal or formless; on the contrary, it is the material dress that is formless and that takes a shape according to the form of the indestructible person. No living entity is originally formless, as is wrongly thought by those with a poor fund of knowledge.

    In the material world, material nature displays wonderful workmanship by creating varieties of bodies for the living beings according to their propensities for sense gratification.

    The living soul who wants to taste stool is given a material body that is quite suitable for eating stoolthat of a hog.

    Thus, one who wants to eat the flesh and blood of other animals may be given a tigers body equipped with suitable teeth and claws.

    But the human being is not meant for eating flesh, nor does he have any desire to taste stool, even in the most aboriginal state.

    But in any case, the material bodies of all animals and men are foreign to the living entity. They change according to the living entitys desire for sense gratification.

    In the cycle of evolution, the living entity changes bodies one after another.

    When the world was full of water, the living entity took an aquatic form. Then he passed to vegetable life, from vegetable life to worm life, from worm life to bird life, from bird life to animal life, and from animal life to the human form.

    The highest developed form is this human form when it is possessed of a full sense of spiritual knowledge.

    The highest development of ones spiritual sense is:

    One should give up the material body, which will be turned to ashes, and allow the air of life to merge into the eternal reservoir of air.

    The yogis generally study how to control the airs of the body. The soul is supposed to rise from one circle of air to another until it rises to the brahma-randhra, the highest circle. From that point the perfect yogi can transfer himself to any planet he likes.

    The process is to give up one material body and then enter into another.

    [But the highest perfection of such changes occurs only when the living entity is able to give up the material body altogether and enter into the spiritual atmosphere, where he can develop a completely different type of bodya spiritual body, which never has to meet death or change.]

    Here in the material world, material nature forces the living entity to change his body due to his different desires for sense gratification.

    These desires are represented in the various species of life, from germs to the most perfected material bodies, those of Brahm and the demigods. All of these living entities have bodies composed of matter in different shapes.

    The intelligent man sees oneness not in the variety of the bodies but in the spiritual identity. The spiritual spark, which is part and parcel of the Supreme Lord, is the same whether he is in a body of a hog or in the body of a demigod, or any living being within the manifest material cosmos.

    The living entity takes on different bodies according to his pious and vicious activities.

    The human body is highly developed and has full consciousness. According to the Bhagavad-gita (Chap 7 verse 19), the most perfect man surrenders unto the Lord after many, many lifetimes of culturing knowledge.

    The culture of knowledge reaches perfection only when the knower comes to the point of surrendering unto the Supreme Lord, Vasudeva.

    Otherwise, even after attaining knowledge of ones spiritual identity, if one does not come to the point of knowing that the living entities are eternal parts and parcels of the whole and can never become the whole, one has to fall down again into the material atmosphere.

    Indeed, one must fall down even if he has become one with the brahmajyoti.

    Sometimes these living Souls want to enjoy their senses, and therefore they are placed in the material world to become false lords under the dictation of the senses.

    The desire for lordship is the material disease of the living being, for under the spell of sense enjoyment he transmigrates through the various bodies manifested in the material world.

    Becoming one with the brahmajyoti does not represent mature knowledge. Only by surrendering unto the Lord completely and developing ones sense of spiritual service does one reach the highest perfectional stage.

    One who is completely under the rule of material nature remembers the heinous activities he performed gets another material body after death.

    The Bhagavad-gita (Chap 8 verse 6) confirms this truth:
    Whatever state of being one remembers when he quits his body, O son of Kunt, that state he will attain without fail.

    Thus the mind carries the living entitys propensities into the next life.

    Unlike the simple animals, who have no developed mind, the dying human being can remember the activities of his life like dreams at night; therefore his mind remains surcharged with material desires, and consequently he cannot enter into the spiritual kingdom with a spiritual body.

    The Bhakti-yoga yogis, however, develop a sense of love for Godhead by practicing devotional service (Bhakti-yoga) to the Lord.

    Even if at the time of death a devotee does not remember his service to the Lord, the Lord does not forget him.

    Unless one is accustomed to devotional practice (Bhakti-yoga), what will he remember at the time of death, when the body is dislocated, and how can he pray to the almighty Lord to remember his sacrifices?

    Sacrifice means denying the interest of the senses. One has to learn this art by employing the senses in the service of the Lord (Bhakti-yoga) during ones lifetime. One can utilize the results of such practice at the time of death.

  10. #10

    Re: evolution & hinduism

    rkpande wrote:
    Sanatan Dharma has answers to all questions a man has.
    Consider the Awatars of the God on the earth (as a process) as given in Purans (Vedas mention only Matsya awatar)
    1 Matsya awatar (Fish) - life evolved in water
    2 kachhapah awatar (Turtle) - a creature both water and land based
    3 Varaha awtar (Boar) - purely a land based creature
    4 narshing awatar (half man half animal)-
    5 vaman awatar (a dwarf man) - a small man so intelligent that with his wits he got all three worlds.
    6 Rama awatar- A perfect human being
    & Krishna awtar- Some say he was more perfect than Rama.

    Here it is. The evolution of the races.
    This is not anything to do with evolution!
    God incarnates as an avatar according to the level of the intelligence of the time & culture and explains "Eternal Duty" (lit., "sanatana-dharma").

    Each of the above Avataras appeared among the royal dynasties of antiquity. Even Varaha (the Boar) appeared to fight with a descendent of the Devatas/Daityas/Adaityas (Kasaypa's grandkids) namely, Hiranyaksha, brother of Hiranyakashipu.

    Vishnu Avataras appear to facilitate material affairs within the material world to re-claim the fallen souls by establishing, at the minimum, yogic-discipline for the sake of free-will pursuance of "Love-of-God" versus "beastial pleasure".

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